Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Usha Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:18 am

crimson king wrote:Thendral Varum Vazhiye and Oliyile, great duets both ruined by Bhavadha's shaky singing. Oliyile is an even bigger loss that way because it's such a haunting tune. It is often said that IR reinvented Tamil folk music in films with Pithamagan/Virumaandi but I think Sethu and Azhagi were the forerunners. He was already beginning to depart from the 80s/90s template there.

CK,
Beautifully told about IR...............He was already beginning to depart from the 80s/90s template there.

Usha Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:27 am

Ilaiyaraja with Vijay. all are so sweet..............

Kadhaluku mariyadhai......... oru pattam poochi.... love a lot....

pattam poochiyai parthavangaluku... adhanudaiya movements.. andha style ai purinjavangaluku........

indha paatil.. andha oru movement ai feel panna mudiyum.. apadi oru composiition indha paatu.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dUwvRXbTxU

IR's Music.. composition is.......

80s - Natural Drinking Water.......

from 90s' - Refined Water..... ( vera vazhi ilamal..... anyway. aim is........ Purified one........)
IR's Own Factory.......No kalapadam.. Fresh one......... Refine............ The Best One......

Drinking water illama... manushanga iruka mudiyuma................. apadi than IR's Compositiion. Just Feelings. Tats all.

kiru Mon Dec 16, 2013 4:22 am

Usha wrote:DM,
same prob to me ... like u.........

quote.. pannina.. adhulayae dhan reply seiya mudiyaradhu.................

Click on the last icon , looks like a page - Switch Editor Mode. Put the cursor where you want to and switch again if you need a visual editor (workaround for obviously an UI bug)

Usha Mon Dec 16, 2013 4:58 pm

kiru wrote:
Usha wrote:DM,
same prob to me ... like u.........

quote.. pannina.. adhulayae dhan reply seiya mudiyaradhu.................

Click on the last icon , looks like a page - Switch Editor Mode. Put the cursor where you want to and switch again if you need a visual editor (workaround for obviously an UI bug)

got it. understood. is this correct. kiru..........

Usha Mon Dec 16, 2013 5:12 pm

crimson king wrote:Oliyile is an even bigger loss that way because it's such a haunting tune. It is often said that IR reinvented Tamil folk music in films with Pithamagan/Virumaandi but I think Sethu and Azhagi were the forerunners. He was already beginning to depart from the 80s/90s template there.

CK .. Beautifully told about IR's Style..........

kiru Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:06 pm

Usha wrote:
kiru wrote:
Usha wrote:DM,
same prob to me ... like u.........

quote.. pannina.. adhulayae dhan reply seiya mudiyaradhu.................

Click on the last icon , looks like a page - Switch Editor Mode. Put the cursor where you want to and switch again if you need a visual editor (workaround for obviously an UI bug)

got it. understood. is this correct. kiru..........

Correct. Super.
BTW, Re: synth usage/90s - More malayalam albums came out very nicely, vs the main success with synths in KM in tamil.
IR relies on the team to do the sound engineering with synths but they do not do a good job (vs the Rahman team, where Rahman himself is personally involved).
IR will only deal with live recording/mixing (volume level of each instrument and probably space/reverb to position the instrument before/behind the singer).
For his skill/style, it is not worth the time sitting in front of the computer and tweaking the sound.

rajkumarc Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:40 am

Kiru - I love some of IR's synth dominated works psot 2000, Mayakannadi being my top favorite. Ulakile Alagi has extraordinary arrangements where synth blends amazingly with acoustic. A fantastic song to listen to both on headphones and to blast it out in a decent sound system.

Listening to Ponnar Shankar, what a delightful album. Kannai Padithen is an extremely sweet number - both the singing & orch. Both of the interludes land you in heaven. Are the violins synth too? If so, they sound lovely and create a very nice feel. My only problem is with the synth beats which stand out as odd but I feel IR as moving away from this kind of beats in his newer synth works (like Thandavakone, Mayilu etc).

kiru Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:46 am

Raj, I too like quite a bit of Raja's synth dominated works. Recently, after NEPV and Megha I am in a different world though :-)
After these albums, listening to strings in another music directors works seems like kid stuff !!!
These works beat any of Raja's previous works in terms of musical ideas and high in emotional content as well.
But he has given us so many desserts and cookies and I do enjoy dipping my hands into the old cookie jar as well :-)

rajkumarc Wed Dec 18, 2013 2:17 am

Very well said Kiru applause

on the variety of music IR has offered us. Totally agree with you on NEPV and Megha. Whenever I start listening to those albums, it usually goes on for days before I switch to any other album of Raja. I can only pity those folks who cannot fully take in what's offered in Megha for instance and instead choose Irandam Ulagam as a better album.

Usha Wed Dec 18, 2013 9:58 am

kiru,
Thanks a lot...........

kiru Thu Dec 19, 2013 5:21 am

@usha - you are welcome
@raj - I have not even heard about irandam ulagam. I am happy to live in my own well, I guess :-) I do have spotify and I sometimes get out of this well.

app_engine Mon Dec 23, 2013 5:33 am

Interesting article on 'poonthaLirAda'

The blogger claims himself to be a musician / composer...some nice writing and there's also some uLaRal IMHO...

இளையராஜாவின் continuity பிரமிக்கத்தக்கது. தொடர்ச்சியான இசை-மனதிலிருந்து எழும் தொடர் வாசங்கள். வெட்டி ஒட்டி சரிபார்க்கப்படாதவை. இயல்பான நடை. மோஸார்ட்டுடையது போல. (ரஹ்மானுடைய தொடர்ச்சியை பெத்தோவனுடயதுடன் ஒப்பிடலாம்). சுஜாதாவின் நடை போல.

ஆனால் இந்த தொடர்ச்சிக்குப் பின்னால் லாஜிக் ஏதும் இருப்பதாகத் தெரியவில்லை. ஒரு ப்ரெலூடிலோ, இண்டர்லூடிலோ அடுத்தடுத்த துணுக்குகள் எந்த அடிப்படையில் பிணைக்கப் பட்டுள்ளன என்பதற்கு விடை ஏதும் கிடைக்காது. ஸ்டூடியோவில் இசைஞர்கள் கிட்டார், புல்லாங்குழல், வயலின் என வைத்துக் கொண்டு காத்திருப்பது காரணமாக இருக்கலாம். resource management. ஆளுக்கொரு பீஸ் போட்டு இந்தாங்க புடிச்சுக்கங்கன்னு கொடுப்பதாயிருக்கலாம்

writeface Mon Dec 23, 2013 8:55 am

app_engine wrote: Interesting article on 'poonthaLirAda'

The blogger claims himself to be a musician / composer...some nice writing and there's also some uLaRal IMHO...

இளையராஜாவின் ... இயல்பான நடை. மோஸார்ட்டுடையது போல. (ரஹ்மானுடைய தொடர்ச்சியை பெத்தோவனுடயதுடன் ஒப்பிடலாம்). சுஜாதாவின் நடை போல.

ஆனால் இந்த தொடர்ச்சிக்குப் பின்னால் லாஜிக் ஏதும் இருப்பதாகத் தெரியவில்லை. ஒரு ப்ரெலூடிலோ, இண்டர்லூடிலோ அடுத்தடுத்த துணுக்குகள் எந்த அடிப்படையில் பிணைக்கப் பட்டுள்ளன என்பதற்கு விடை ஏதும் கிடைக்காது. ஸ்டூடியோவில் இசைஞர்கள் கிட்டார், புல்லாங்குழல், வயலின் என வைத்துக் கொண்டு காத்திருப்பது காரணமாக இருக்கலாம். resource management. ஆளுக்கொரு பீஸ் போட்டு இந்தாங்க புடிச்சுக்கங்கன்னு கொடுப்பதாயிருக்கலாம்

Comparing IR's musical phrasing to Sujatha.. Come on now! Quite silly.

Gokul.

kiru Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:23 am

writeface wrote:
Comparing IR's musical phrasing to Sujatha.. Come on now! Quite silly.

Gokul.

Which Sujatha do you think he is referring to ? :-)
BTW, the writer has lost all credibility when he said Rahman's continuity is like that of Beethoven's :-) Comparing somebody's style to Beethoven where the guy does not even provide notes for the string section and somebody has to 'arrange' it. The guy creates a tune .. albeit a hit potential but does not think making it multi-part and/or contrapuntal is not his job !!!

fring151 Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:52 pm

kiru wrote:
writeface wrote:
Comparing IR's musical phrasing to Sujatha.. Come on now! Quite silly.

Gokul.

Which Sujatha do you think he is referring to ? :-)
BTW, the writer has lost all credibility when he said Rahman's continuity is like that of Beethoven's :-) Comparing somebody's style to Beethoven where the guy does not even provide notes for the string section and somebody has to 'arrange' it. The guy creates a tune .. albeit a hit potential but does not think making it multi-part and/or contrapuntal is not his job !!!

I second that. The comparison is patent nonsense. Many Indian journalists and bloggers have a penchant for sacrificing accuracy and precision at the altar of punch dialogues. You cannot simply make a mottai comparison with someone like Beethoven without giving proper justification. Zero rigour. Zero credibility.

crimson king Mon Dec 23, 2013 5:12 pm

I didn't read it but I wonder what continuity exactly is he referring to w.r.t Rahman. I always thought Rahman's main aspect of differentiation from IR was to abandon the tight 'logic', the mathematical precision and go freestyle. I am very surprised a person who claims to be a musician would compare Rahman to Beethoven for continuity.

fring151 Mon Dec 23, 2013 5:55 pm

crimson king wrote:I didn't read it but I wonder what continuity exactly is he referring to w.r.t Rahman. I always thought Rahman's main aspect of differentiation from IR was to abandon the tight 'logic', the mathematical precision and go freestyle. I am very surprised a person who claims to be a musician would compare Rahman to Beethoven for continuity.

No justification. Just matter-of-fact statement that ARR's 'continuity' can be compared to Beethoven's . The continuity he refers to seems to be the natural flow of his music. Pristine, untampered, straight from the heart kind of innocence and beauty. Einstein is said to have once said that while Beethoven created his music, Mozart's seemed to have always existed, waiting for someone to discover it. I suspect that is where the writer is coming from. Seri adhellAm oru pakkam irukkatum saar, ARRayum Beethovenayum endha adippadayil oppidreenga?

More irritating is this:

ஆனால் இந்த தொடர்ச்சிக்குப் பின்னால் லாஜிக் ஏதும் இருப்பதாகத் தெரியவில்லை. ஒரு ப்ரெலூடிலோ, இண்டர்லூடிலோ அடுத்தடுத்த துணுக்குகள் எந்த அடிப்படையில் பிணைக்கப் பட்டுள்ளன என்பதற்கு விடை ஏதும் கிடைக்காது. ஸ்டூடியோவில் இசைஞர்கள் கிட்டார், புல்லாங்குழல், வயலின் என வைத்துக் கொண்டு காத்திருப்பது காரணமாக இருக்கலாம். resource management. ஆளுக்கொரு பீஸ் போட்டு இந்தாங்க புடிச்சுக்கங்கன்னு கொடுப்பதாயிருக்கலாம்.

He is suggesting here that there seems to be no logic behind the continuity and instrument choice of IR in this song. He further has the gall to go on to say that it is probably the case that IR wanted all the studio musicians to have something to play rather than nothing. i.e there is no reason for the precise choice of instruments and arrangements. It is arbitrary and done for "resource management". What a waste of bandwith.

crimson king Mon Dec 23, 2013 5:58 pm

lol, yeah, I had read the first sentence of that portion and the word resource and just skipped over it. Anybody who claims IR's continuity is not founded in logic doesn't really need an audience, he is a special ONE! Razz

fring151 Mon Dec 23, 2013 6:06 pm

fring151 wrote:No justification. Just matter-of-fact statement that ARR's 'continuity' can be compared to Beethoven's . The continuity he refers to seems to be the natural flow of his music. Pristine, untampered, straight from the heart kind of innocence and beauty. Einstein is said to have once said that while Beethoven created his music, Mozart's seemed to have always existed, waiting for someone to discover it. I suspect that is where the writer is coming from. Seri adhellAm oru pakkam irukkatum saar, ARRayum Beethovenayum endha adippadayil oppidreenga?

Just to clarify this, he has compared IR's continuity to Mozart. The pristine, untampered, straight from the heart continuity he attributes to IR and "ARR's continuity", he compares to Beethoven's.

fring151 Mon Dec 23, 2013 7:02 pm

And thinking about it, I disagree even with this Mozart continuity comparison. IR throws up many more surprises in a composition than Mozart and many of those surprises don't really flow naturally. They make one wonder how he landed on that note when the natural course would have taken him to some other place.

Usha Tue Dec 24, 2013 3:36 pm

Engirundho ennai - I love India.

IR's Chorus and IR's Guitar. always amazing.............

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMHXo_38f20

jaiganesh Tue Dec 24, 2013 10:39 pm

As far as continuity in poonthalirada and logic is concerned- it is in the narration of the song sequence
as told to Raaja by directors. If there is a cognizant picture there - Raaja's imagination will stay truthful to
director's vision and that of the characters involved. Trying to observe Raaja's works only from a musical
prism will never give a complete picture of why this and that. It just means that the person
is able to observe one colour of the spectrum (musical) correctly. I am tired of reading such half formed conjectures in
minds of imbeciles.

writeface Wed Dec 25, 2013 10:32 pm

What a classic song! See the pace for a sad song....The flute in the first interlude kills me...

https://soundcloud.com/raja4ever/hires-daevaninkovil

Gokul

kv Thu Dec 26, 2013 9:17 am

Speed of Raaja’s melodies has been something that has always had me curious. He seems to like to keep his melodies pretty ‘brisk’, doesn’t he? Trying to quickly recall songs that are comparatively slow in tempo, the list I’m able to form in my head is rather short (I’m thinking vaana mazhai pOlE pace, ok?). That the songs can be dripping & drenched in their emotions, be it romance or melancholy or happiness or peace, is beyond any doubt, but the tempo he sets them to, IMO, has very seldom been ‘really’ slow. Even an emotionally crushing, devastating song like engE sellum indha pAdhai is pretty briskly-paced. Even his latest offering, Oru Oorla, has a lovely melody - vanathil vanna - with beautiful chord work & lovely tune. Other composers (let’s say Vishal Bharadwaj/ARR) would likely have set it to a much slower tempo, I’d imagine; look at what our man does here! And this has often had me wondering on what thought process might be driving this in that complex circuitry of the rAkshasan’s brain (“composing is not from the brain” nu saar kOchupaar, adhu vEra vishayam!). Is it that he doesn’t like his songs to be ‘meandering’? Has this got something to do with the precision & song-structuring from the WCM school of thought? Or is it something as simple as trying to match the visuals the songs are set to? Has the man himself ever spoken about this in any interviews/discussions?

Bala (Karthik) Fri Dec 27, 2013 1:26 am

KV
Exactly. Speed, uniquely Raaja

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