Re: Super Singer - Singers of the future

crimson king Sat Sep 07, 2013 9:58 am

It depends if you are referring here to Tamil music or also Hindi film music or music in general. The Madan Mohan gem Rukhe Rukhe Se Kadam immediately comes to my mind when I think of great guitar. But what I like about the Mannil interlude is it has two layers of guitar in an interaction. That is pretty unique in Indian film music and there are not many examples I can think of in Western either. I mean, there are plenty of tracks with not two but three or even more layers of guitar but not necessarily in such a tightly co ordinated arrangement where each note is like a response to the previous one. More like the guitars conversing with each other...wonderful stuff.

Anyway, here's Rukhe Rukhe....arguably the template of the Jagjit Singh mould of ghazals.

jaiganesh Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:02 am

crimson king wrote:It depends if you are referring here to Tamil music or also Hindi film music or music in general. The Madan Mohan gem Rukhe Rukhe Se Kadam immediately comes to my mind when I think of great guitar. But what I like about the Mannil interlude is it has two layers of guitar in an interaction. That is pretty unique in Indian film music and there are not many examples I can think of in Western either. I mean, there are plenty of tracks with not two but three or even more layers of guitar but not necessarily in such a tightly co ordinated arrangement where each note is like a response to the previous one. More like the guitars conversing with each other...wonderful stuff.

Anyway, here's Rukhe Rukhe....arguably the template of the Jagjit Singh mould of ghazals.

i am not hinting at arrangement - the twang sound - usage is almost like 'veena' totally unlike guitar (electric or accoustic).

crimson king Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:04 am

I don't get that feeling in this song but I do get it in some other of his songs. And yes, I haven't heard it done anywhere else, at least not before.

crimson king Sat Sep 07, 2013 10:10 am

If by twang, you are referring to the 'bending' of the tone, it is pretty normal in electric guitar...but it is not used much in Indian film music for some reason. It's usually either acoustic guitar or distorted electric riffs.

fring151 Sat Sep 07, 2013 11:50 am

This is another instance of guitars in counterpoint- quite rare even in rock, especially such intricately woven riffs. And yes, the twang of the second guitar which you talk about is due to bended strings - whole tone bend followed by semitone bend in this case. But as you observe, the tone is definitely unique - Not the first IR song where the unusual tone of the electric guitar has struck me. Can you guys share the link of the performance by Sharath, I am unable to find it for some reason.

crimson king Sat Sep 07, 2013 12:06 pm

I am not able to load the video for whatever reason. Just put a youtube search for Super Singer: Sep 4, 2013. Santosh's performance starts at 30:30.

app_engine Sat Sep 07, 2013 6:35 pm

fring151 wrote: Can you guys share the link of the performance by Sharath, I am unable to find it for some reason.

Here you go:

Effortless!

fring151 Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:43 pm

Thanks App_ji. Very impressive singing!

Usha Sat Sep 07, 2013 11:16 pm

Parvathi - Amrutha tv pugazh. romba azhaga padum indha ponnu....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4u5rua3UZ4

IR troup members patri.. solranga. ellarum.........

rajkumarc Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:05 am

Usha wrote:Parvathi - Amrutha tv pugazh. romba azhaga padum indha ponnu....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4u5rua3UZ4

IR troup members patri.. solranga. ellarum.........

SJ was lost in nostalgia during a few of those performances and mentioned about how she loved all the orchestral arrangements.

As to Paadu Nilaave, Srini was dedicating the whole effect to Viji Manuel who I thought was the main keyboard player in IR's troupe. There were strings, guitar and everything in that song which gave the overall beauty and Srini was pretty partial to Viji. It's also because Viji might have helped ARR in his early career or was involved with ARR more (I think ARR himself had acknowledged that in some interview). So, Srini (going by his past track recored) had a valid reason to mention Viji's name Smile

. BTW, did Viji separate out from IR's troupe only because of his health or was there anything else going on?

vicks Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:10 pm

I am shocked/surprised that SJ never once mentioned IR! Vijay TV, mokka Judges not mentioning ellam pazhagi pochu.. But SJ? She mentions ARR, Vidyasagar, some old composer etc, but not IR Crying or Very sad

app_engine Tue Sep 10, 2013 4:07 pm

vicks wrote:I am shocked/surprised that SJ never once mentioned IR! Vijay TV, mokka Judges not mentioning ellam pazhagi pochu.. But SJ? She mentions ARR, Vidyasagar, some old composer etc, but not IR

Well, technically speaking, she mentioned once Laughing

(That Sadha worked for IR)

Otherwise, it's possible she had been "requested" to refrain from talking about IR Wink

Or, it could be the other way - that she is possibly tired of being told often as "someone brought up by IR" Smile

(Please refer to her wiki page whose link I've posted in the SJ thread of IR forum)

**V_S** Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:34 pm

Funniest round in SS4. Judges get to choose the singers (pair) for one on one challenge, but the singers get to choose the genres for the other (competitor) singer. If the singer does not correctly choose a genre which is difficult for other (competitor) singer to sing, they tend to loose irrespective of how good songs they choose and sing. So, the result is not just based on their singing, it also depends on how best they choose the weak genre for others.

Result: Good singers are in danger zone and weak singers are in safe zone. Good singers have to sing once more to prove and come out of danger zone while mediocre prevail.

On top of it, erroneous judging. Judging based on the performance rather than on the kind and difficulty of the song chosen. Some very bland songs are winning (with not much effort from singers) while the ones who chose difficult songs are loosing. Great going!

jaiganesh Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:51 pm

V_S wrote:Funniest round in SS4. Judges get to choose the singers (pair) for one on one challenge, but the singers get to choose the genres for the other (competitor) singer. If the singer does not correctly choose a genre which is difficult for other (competitor) singer to sing, they tend to loose irrespective of how good songs they choose and sing. So, the result is not just based on their singing, it also depends on how best they choose the weak genre for others.

Result: Good singers are in danger zone and weak singers are in safe zone. Good singers have to sing once more to prove and come out of danger zone while mediocre prevail.

On top of it, erroneous judging. Judging based on the performance rather than on the kind and difficulty of the song chosen. Some very bland songs are winning (with not much effort from singers) while the ones who chose difficult songs are loosing. Great going!

u are talking about syed subhan who messed up big time who is in safe zone vs. sai vignesh - who did a decent manjal veyyil sans the 'american accent' (which counts a lot these days in thamizh naadu u see). yeah - funny ..

**V_S** Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:32 am

Yeah, Newyork nagaram is a very bland song and has nothing in it for stage performance wandering aimlessly with no soul. I am even talking about Rizwan and Parvathi. Even though Rizwan selected a nice song, he didn't sing well, while Parvathi sang well, but the song is not challenging. On the other hand, Ramesh sang ok compared to Rizwan and Madhumitha sang well that too a difficult song.

My reco would be to go with the same song (in their weaker genre) and see who excels better. What they are doing is not a worthy one on one, rather a prejudice (from judges). Before even they sing (in pairs) they (judges know and predetermine) who is going to win which makes it a no contest. That should not be the case.

**V_S** Wed Sep 18, 2013 11:54 pm

I felt lot of judging errors from last week to this week so far. I was surprised by the performer of the week for last week. Even though Parvathi sang very well, the song didn't have anything to celebrate in it. I believe song also matters in addition to singing. Surprisingly Sanjay sang both the songs last week (+monday) good, but was eliminated, compared to other weak contestants. Actually the criteria (as mentioned in last two posts) is itself funny. It's more of luck factor which decides the loser not the singer themselves. Same way Narayanan and Madhumitha sang the second song (2 minute) very well (except some minor issues), but were in danger zone again.

Last week one good thing happened which did a real nose-cut for judges when they judged Vaijayanthi to danger zone and Imman suggested otherwise, which clearly proves how their judging is bad sometimes. This week (yesterday), Soundarya sang extremely well, but she is in danger zone while Sharath Santhosh and Narayanan did not sing well at all with lot of sruthi issues, still they went to safe zone. I believe Soundarya is last season's Sai Saran for judges. However good she performs, she ends in a wrong corner. I am clearly seeing lot of bias against her. That's the reason she never won performer of the week so far even after choosing difficult songs and delivering.

**V_S** Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:59 pm

I wrote in twitter today about the same thing. It's a pity that we can judge the judges. @karthikarul nailed it that if you sing a ARR song, you are sure to be in safe zone how bad you sing that song. It was happening when the three amigos stepped-in but not frequently, but now especially last few weeks I am seeing it clearly. This week there are some contestants (especially Syed Subhan) sang very badly and lot and lot of sruthi issues and almost butchered a beautiful song. Same way Arvind Srinivas expected sarangi will play after his turn, but he didn't do and he had to continue (rehersal mistakes showing up in singing) and did a unconvincing end to the song. Yet both of them are in safe zone.

Compared to these two, even Ramesh did a nice job, but the reason they gave for putting him in danger zone was one mistake in 'thaalam' which no one could see it. Same way girls sang very well this week compared to other singers in safe zone, but with not much reasoning they put them in danger zone as they selected IR songs and also due to some preconceived notion about the singers, rather than their performance on that day. Really sad to see Super Singer 4 is going this way.

Another point about this round is while the Sarangi player did tremendously well, but it would have sound more better with independent playing rather than playing with the song. It sounded way too much away from the song and did not sync with the song most of the time, especially Raja's songs. But due to his playing, some singers are escaping out of their mediocrity, as he is giving the feel judges wanted and judges intentionally convince themselves that the singers (especially their favorite singers) are giving that feel and fooling themselves and disappointing other contestants.

crimson king Sat Sep 21, 2013 4:09 pm

The other problem for Arvind in his performance was he sounded very strained that day. I have heard him sing pretty high before in this show but that day, he simply 'pulled out' of it. The highs in that song are meant to be sung full on to emphasise the pathos while he sounded flat and tired. I was shocked that none of the judges pointed that out. Either there is some serious ARR-slant going on or the performance was actually different from what we hear in the televised recording...i.e. the voice sounded better live than in the recording.

crimson king Sat Sep 21, 2013 4:15 pm

As for Ramesh, if they don't want to let an autokaaran become a top 10 (or even win the prize, who knows) they might as well say it flat out. His timing issues this week were very mild. If the standard was very high, I would not excuse it but in the midst of some mediocre performances, it sounds like nit picking to fault him for that one mistake. I am not a trained singer but I have learnt a little bit of it and sung with a full band on stage and let me just say that Ramesh's timbre simply stands out from the crowd. His voice is marvellous....well rounded, naturally melodious and dynamic and very clear. For the voice alone, he beats most of the contestants and on top of that he is very expressive too. I don't understand the attempt to present him as one of the weaker contestants. He is anything but. IMO a much better singer than Syed, Shenbagaraj, Arvind or Sai Vignesh. If the judging is so bad, they might as well open the show to voting (like Indian Idol) and then we shall see.

Drunkenmunk Sat Sep 21, 2013 10:30 pm

Diwakar was a surprise with Paadadha Themaangu. Beautifully rendered and Srinivas thought it might have been a bad choice but got convinced the way Diwakar rendered it LOL

crimson king Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:59 am

Diwakar is a good singer. He and Ramesh are my favourites from the guys. And Diwakar is more versatile than Ramesh, though Ramesh is still The Voice. Both just get into the flow and express themselves. They don't have to attempt very technically challenging songs to impress the judges because they can own a simple song on stage.

app_engine Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:54 pm

dig

An old SS performance, shared by someone in twitter - AWESOME, especially when she does repeat of saraNam per judge's request :

end-dig

crimson king Sun Sep 22, 2013 4:19 pm

Dig indeed! Priyanka has such an amazing voice. It's almost too good, she sounds so effortless it almost feels casual.

**V_S** Sat Sep 28, 2013 4:52 am

Surprised by today's danger zone contestants. Never expected those four and none of the four deserved to be in danger zone. Instead Narayanan, Rizwan should be there for rendering hopelessly. Narayanan's voice broke when he went to higher pitch and Rizwan for so many sruthi slips (unbearable!). Also Diwakar and Syed Subhaan are choosing very easy songs and escaping. Don't know why these are not noticed when other contestants are sweating out by taking challenging compositions. If Soundarya's breath control is a problem why there is no problem for bad sruthi issues. I would have given performer of the week to either Deepthi, Krishnan, Sarath Santhosh, Arvind Srinivas or Sai Vignesh for bringing the devotional feel and choosing some difficult songs.

Other issues:
Sonia is not singing openly and I can see she is singing her own song with her own sangathis (with some mushed approach), I don't get the feel of listening to the original. Parvathi even though she sang well, I don't get that devotional feel from that song. Somehow feel they are over hyping mallu contestants despite some excellent performances from Deepthi, Sai Vignesh, Sarath Santhosh (that was a very difficult song). I already sense the finalists now not from their singing but by the judges.

app_engine Sat Sep 28, 2013 5:25 pm

V_S wrote: Somehow feel they are over hyping mallu contestants

"feel" ellAm illainga - factu Smile

Vijay TV & all three main judges are KL-biased, and they don't hide it.

In addition there was PJ in that week! He shamelessly sang a Malayalam song as a guest in a program on a Thamizh channel that supposedly searches for "TN's brammANdakkural thEdal" (where all top probables are from outside-TN) Laughing

It's a shame as if there were no TF songs that PJ knew. (To my knowledge, PJ got more fame / recognition from TFM than MFM.)

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