Re: Anything about IR found on the net - Vol 4

jaiganesh Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:49 am

This is like saying, the businessman who lost business luckily has 'time for family and fishing'. Joke apart, Whether there were producers waiting or not, Raaja is
always in the studio for 12+ hours.
With or without ARR, the invasion of modern sound engineering into the realms of music making was inevitable. The outcome whichever way it could have rolled up, would have had no bearing in the conversation around Raaja. He blazed his own trail in 70s and 80s and would have continued to do the same and which as Suresh has shown through various links. On an individual song, the Baradwaj ranganish trait of "Oh I would have loved it if there had been trumpet in place of sax or if the 6th violin had gone a little piannissimo" is something that is not going to reveal any new observations on art, it will only make the listener a faux or proxy composer. If such thoughts dominate the appreciation, then it is safer to say, "let me go off to compose my own music".

crimson king Wed Apr 26, 2017 3:20 am

jaiganesh wrote:This is like saying, the businessman who lost business luckily has 'time for family and fishing'. Joke apart, Whether there were producers waiting or not, Raaja is
always in the studio for 12+ hours.
With or without ARR, the invasion of modern sound engineering into the realms of music making was inevitable. The outcome whichever way it could have rolled up, would have had no bearing in the conversation around Raaja. He blazed his own trail in 70s and 80s and would have continued to do the same and which as Suresh has shown through various links. On an individual song, the Baradwaj ranganish trait of "Oh I would have loved it if there had been trumpet in place of sax or if the 6th violin had gone a little piannissimo" is something that is not going to reveal any new observations on art, it will only make the listener a faux or proxy composer. If such thoughts dominate the appreciation, then it is safer to say, "let me go off to compose my own music".

1. He was not out of work and in any case his worst work in the late 90s and early noughties was for the chocolatey Vijay hits. So it doesn't suggest that he himself was thirsting for such assignments. He said in an interview himself (around the time of Cheeni Kum) that at this point he only wanted to take up projects that interested him. There is a precedent for this; RD did some great work with Gulzar in the 80s when otherwise he was very much in decline.
2.With the benefit of hindsight, even WW1 would appear inevitable. In Mumbai, we did not find Anu or JL or NS particularly eager to upgrade themselves even after ARR had arrived. As long as he made only intermittent appearances in Hindi - mostly very successful ones, esp in the 90s - they were not bothered and did the same shoddy, lousy work with cheap sounding percussions they had already been doing. It was SEL who finally drove them out of the market because they were the first to bring ARR-like sound engineering to Bollywood (other than ARR himself). There were plenty of songs in the 90s by the likes of SAR or Sirpi for that matter which didn't boast amazing sound quality. So it was not inevitable in the 90s. By the noughties, the technology had finally become affordable enough that more composers could move to it and also a new generation like HJ may have been more comfortable with computers. IFM would have looked very different without ARR. It's not about one's likes or dislikes. I don't like Roja all that much for that matter (and it might be my next submission to BR saar!!!) but I have seen thathas and paatis humming Rukmani at the time, so widespread was its appeal. Now were they all paid by Vairam or KB to do so?
3.If you want to uncritically accept everything done by IR or any other composer, you go ahead. I don't do that with anybody and don't need your unsolicited advice. Yes, the composer is entitled to his decisions and I as the listener to my preferences, simple as that. Mostly, it is subconscious so your asking me to check my subconscious reactions to the music is unfeasible.

kiru Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:31 am

CK, take it easy ..Jai says one thing and you say something else.. I dont get it my friend. இசை நம்மை பண் படுத்த வேண்டும் புண் படுத்தக்கூடாது . Relax.
Anyways, coming back to your TriBullet answer to my post -( I think you will have quite a avocation if you started a TriBullet Blog Very Happy

)
#1 - I assert it is the (lack of) readiness from the audience IR hesitated to go full-throttle on WCM integrated film songs. I can list a number of such songs which received lukewarm response. For that matter, even NEPV and Megha did not receive the raves which I thought they should (including from among my friends here Very Happy

if I like auna neevena they prefer punnami, if I pick aadhiushas they vote for kunnathe).
#2 - well.. you are probably missing the woods for the trees.. IR might have done "mokkai" or crap songs as you would call it. There could be many reasons - just to make money, director or audience likes it or he might have been just experimenting or pure bored. I do not bother with the whole repertoire.
#3 - Re: "It is my opinion that the changes from the 90s through to the present day are more dramatic vis-a-vis from 76 to early 90s" -
I am with Shank on this. IR came to the industry to "do music with a big orchestra" and he has been working on this goal from day one. It is a continuum. As he himself says, he is still learning .. learning ICM, learning WCM ..learning jazz.. We get more and more fine-grained integration with WCM .. and personally I like this direction .. it is why I wish/pray he is blessed with health and long life .. this is true genre creation.

crimson king Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:11 am

@ kiru Saar, I am relaxed only. This piece has incensed a lot of people but that I can't help.

I am going to let points 1 and 2 go because we don't disagree broadly and the specifics are a matter of how much significance each attaches to the same.

Re IR wanted to do music with a big orchestra, there are several counter examples. Off the top of my head, Mandram Vandha (guitar, keyboard and sax), Ilaya Nila (guitar, keyboard, flute), Enna Satham (guitar, flute, sax, keyboard), chinna Mani, etc. So I am reluctant to pin it down to one phrase like that only because his music is vast and his versatility is phenomenal. I think rather that like a fox he has kept cunningly pushing his music further and further from where he started but he periodically revisits old ideas maybe partly to see if he can do something more with it and partly to give something familiar to hold onto for the listeners. So ishq e fillum in shamitabh was a total throwback while the other tracks were very modern. In NEPV itself, vaanam mella and ennodu vaa vaa are more familiar.

app_engine Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:35 pm

Frank Dubier passed away

“The legendary trumpet player, Frank Dubier who played a stellar role in MSV and Ilaiyaraaja Sir's compositions is no more. Please remember him in your prayers”

The article claims he was the one who played wind instrument in manRam vandha thenRalukku & sangeetha mEgam.

jaiganesh Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:21 am

crimson king wrote:
jaiganesh wrote:This is like saying, the businessman who lost business luckily has 'time for family and fishing'. Joke apart, Whether there were producers waiting or not, Raaja is
always in the studio for 12+ hours.
With or without ARR, the invasion of modern sound engineering into the realms of music making was inevitable. The outcome whichever way it could have rolled up, would have had no bearing in the conversation around Raaja. He blazed his own trail in 70s and 80s and would have continued to do the same and which as Suresh has shown through various links. On an individual song, the Baradwaj ranganish trait of "Oh I would have loved it if there had been trumpet in place of sax or if the 6th violin had gone a little piannissimo" is something that is not going to reveal any new observations on art, it will only make the listener a faux or proxy composer. If such thoughts dominate the appreciation, then it is safer to say, "let me go off to compose my own music".
1. He was not out of work and in any case his worst work in the late 90s and early noughties was for the chocolatey Vijay hits. So it doesn't suggest that he himself was thirsting for such assignments. He said in an interview himself (around the time of Cheeni Kum) that at this point he only wanted to take up projects that interested him. There is a precedent for this; RD did some great work with Gulzar in the 80s when otherwise he was very much in decline.
2.With the benefit of hindsight, even WW1 would appear inevitable. In Mumbai, we did not find Anu or JL or NS particularly eager to upgrade themselves even after ARR had arrived. As long as he made only intermittent appearances in Hindi - mostly very successful ones, esp in the 90s - they were not bothered and did the same shoddy, lousy work with cheap sounding percussions they had already been doing. It was SEL who finally drove them out of the market because they were the first to bring ARR-like sound engineering to Bollywood (other than ARR himself). There were plenty of songs in the 90s by the likes of SAR or Sirpi for that matter which didn't boast amazing sound quality. So it was not inevitable in the 90s. By the noughties, the technology had finally become affordable enough that more composers could move to it and also a new generation like HJ may have been more comfortable with computers. IFM would have looked very different without ARR. It's not about one's likes or dislikes. I don't like Roja all that much for that matter (and it might be my next submission to BR saar!!!) but I have seen thathas and paatis humming Rukmani at the time, so widespread was its appeal. Now were they all paid by Vairam or KB to do so?
3.If you want to uncritically accept everything done by IR or any other composer, you go ahead. I don't do that with anybody and don't need your unsolicited advice. Yes, the composer is entitled to his decisions and I as the listener to my preferences, simple as that. Mostly, it is subconscious so your asking me to check my subconscious reactions to the music is unfeasible.

Wow..
you are way off tangent.. I don't intend to question the popularity of rukkumani rukkumani - provided that is the max that ARR could come up to for an erotic situation. are you suggesting that popularity is the benchmark of quality here? if so what is 'quality'? mere technical finesse and package can be counted as quality from a 'production process' stand point (like the QC OK sticker in the bottom of a mixie). For a listener to evolve into 'art appreciation' ,these are very minuscule elements that make up 'Quality'. In Raaja's music, I look for his 'harmony', ' intricacy', 'appropriateness to dramatic context', 'addition to genre material or elevation of chosen genre', 'expression of artist/creator's individuality' - If one looks at the output of Raaja through 90s and 2000s one is bound to find that the 'popularity' and 'crispness of sound engineering' , 'product packaging', 'media hyping' have added the element of bias against Raaja's music heavily. Devoid of all that, one finds that even in a heavily synth laden work of shiva sainya (kannada) Raaja packs enough of his experimental stuff of high 'integral quality' in it. If you haven't observed his music from that angle, then what vijay or yours truly say is bound to irritate you. My unsolicited advice is for anyone reading these pages as long as they live in the cyberspace, Do not approach Raaja's music from your chair with arm rests like you do of any other music director, for you are bound to eat back your words upon a different time, different circumstance when the real essence of the music opens to you when you have thrown away 'music critic' hat and are totally unguarded. Then you might not have this forum or me to listen to your admission (not that I am keen on listening to it).

crimson king Thu Apr 27, 2017 3:28 am

jaiganesh wrote:
crimson king wrote:
jaiganesh wrote:This is like saying, the businessman who lost business luckily has 'time for family and fishing'. Joke apart, Whether there were producers waiting or not, Raaja is
always in the studio for 12+ hours.
With or without ARR, the invasion of modern sound engineering into the realms of music making was inevitable. The outcome whichever way it could have rolled up, would have had no bearing in the conversation around Raaja. He blazed his own trail in 70s and 80s and would have continued to do the same and which as Suresh has shown through various links. On an individual song, the Baradwaj ranganish trait of "Oh I would have loved it if there had been trumpet in place of sax or if the 6th violin had gone a little piannissimo" is something that is not going to reveal any new observations on art, it will only make the listener a faux or proxy composer. If such thoughts dominate the appreciation, then it is safer to say, "let me go off to compose my own music".
1. He was not out of work and in any case his worst work in the late 90s and early noughties was for the chocolatey Vijay hits. So it doesn't suggest that he himself was thirsting for such assignments. He said in an interview himself (around the time of Cheeni Kum) that at this point he only wanted to take up projects that interested him. There is a precedent for this; RD did some great work with Gulzar in the 80s when otherwise he was very much in decline.
2.With the benefit of hindsight, even WW1 would appear inevitable. In Mumbai, we did not find Anu or JL or NS particularly eager to upgrade themselves even after ARR had arrived. As long as he made only intermittent appearances in Hindi - mostly very successful ones, esp in the 90s - they were not bothered and did the same shoddy, lousy work with cheap sounding percussions they had already been doing. It was SEL who finally drove them out of the market because they were the first to bring ARR-like sound engineering to Bollywood (other than ARR himself). There were plenty of songs in the 90s by the likes of SAR or Sirpi for that matter which didn't boast amazing sound quality. So it was not inevitable in the 90s. By the noughties, the technology had finally become affordable enough that more composers could move to it and also a new generation like HJ may have been more comfortable with computers. IFM would have looked very different without ARR. It's not about one's likes or dislikes. I don't like Roja all that much for that matter (and it might be my next submission to BR saar!!!) but I have seen thathas and paatis humming Rukmani at the time, so widespread was its appeal. Now were they all paid by Vairam or KB to do so?
3.If you want to uncritically accept everything done by IR or any other composer, you go ahead. I don't do that with anybody and don't need your unsolicited advice. Yes, the composer is entitled to his decisions and I as the listener to my preferences, simple as that. Mostly, it is subconscious so your asking me to check my subconscious reactions to the music is unfeasible.
Wow..
you are way off tangent.. I don't intend to question the popularity of rukkumani rukkumani - provided that is the max that ARR could come up to for an erotic situation. are you suggesting that popularity is the benchmark of quality here? if so what is 'quality'? mere technical finesse and package can be counted as quality from a 'production process' stand point (like the QC OK sticker in the bottom of a mixie). For a listener to evolve into 'art appreciation' ,these are very minuscule elements that make up 'Quality'. In Raaja's music, I look for his 'harmony', ' intricacy', 'appropriateness to dramatic context', 'addition to genre material or elevation of chosen genre', 'expression of artist/creator's individuality' - If one looks at the output of Raaja through 90s and 2000s one is bound to find that the 'popularity' and 'crispness of sound engineering' , 'product packaging', 'media hyping' have added the element of bias against Raaja's music heavily. Devoid of all that, one finds that even in a heavily synth laden work of shiva sainya (kannada) Raaja packs enough of his experimental stuff of high 'integral quality' in it. If you haven't observed his music from that angle, then what vijay or yours truly say is bound to irritate you. My unsolicited advice is for anyone reading these pages as long as they live in the cyberspace, Do not approach Raaja's music from your chair with arm rests like you do of any other music director, for you are bound to eat back your words upon a different time, different circumstance when the real essence of the music opens to you when you have thrown away 'music critic' hat and are totally unguarded. Then you might not have this forum or me to listen to your admission (not that I am keen on listening to it).

I never said I equated popularity to quality and I think my point is pretty crystal clear if you actually read ONLY the words I used instead of trying so hard to repeatedly infer an agenda behind them. So here is my unsolicited advice to you - and I am really not going to bother responding to the rest of it - first try to understand what is written before responding. It may only take a minute to react but that does not mean your reaction is accurate. That's all. I am done with this. I have clarified my position enough and am under no obligation to explain MYSELF or MY musical creed. I thought we already knew but if you want to behave like a bhakt and call everything into question, go ahead, what difference does it make to me. I only find it amusing.

app_engine Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:19 pm

Looks like Vijay Yesudass had learnt something from the twitter conversation he had with "mafia" Laughing

See this interview:

http://cinema.dinamalar.com/tamil-news/58703/cinema/Kollywood/vijay-yesudas-likes-actress-trisha.htm

Anything about IR found on the net - Vol 4 - Page 16 Vijay_10

Anything about IR found on the net - Vol 4 - Page 16 Vijay_10

jaiganesh Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:12 pm

crimson king wrote:
jaiganesh wrote:
crimson king wrote:
jaiganesh wrote:This is like saying, the businessman who lost business luckily has 'time for family and fishing'. Joke apart, Whether there were producers waiting or not, Raaja is
always in the studio for 12+ hours.
With or without ARR, the invasion of modern sound engineering into the realms of music making was inevitable. The outcome whichever way it could have rolled up, would have had no bearing in the conversation around Raaja. He blazed his own trail in 70s and 80s and would have continued to do the same and which as Suresh has shown through various links. On an individual song, the Baradwaj ranganish trait of "Oh I would have loved it if there had been trumpet in place of sax or if the 6th violin had gone a little piannissimo" is something that is not going to reveal any new observations on art, it will only make the listener a faux or proxy composer. If such thoughts dominate the appreciation, then it is safer to say, "let me go off to compose my own music".
1. He was not out of work and in any case his worst work in the late 90s and early noughties was for the chocolatey Vijay hits. So it doesn't suggest that he himself was thirsting for such assignments. He said in an interview himself (around the time of Cheeni Kum) that at this point he only wanted to take up projects that interested him. There is a precedent for this; RD did some great work with Gulzar in the 80s when otherwise he was very much in decline.
2.With the benefit of hindsight, even WW1 would appear inevitable. In Mumbai, we did not find Anu or JL or NS particularly eager to upgrade themselves even after ARR had arrived. As long as he made only intermittent appearances in Hindi - mostly very successful ones, esp in the 90s - they were not bothered and did the same shoddy, lousy work with cheap sounding percussions they had already been doing. It was SEL who finally drove them out of the market because they were the first to bring ARR-like sound engineering to Bollywood (other than ARR himself). There were plenty of songs in the 90s by the likes of SAR or Sirpi for that matter which didn't boast amazing sound quality. So it was not inevitable in the 90s. By the noughties, the technology had finally become affordable enough that more composers could move to it and also a new generation like HJ may have been more comfortable with computers. IFM would have looked very different without ARR. It's not about one's likes or dislikes. I don't like Roja all that much for that matter (and it might be my next submission to BR saar!!!) but I have seen thathas and paatis humming Rukmani at the time, so widespread was its appeal. Now were they all paid by Vairam or KB to do so?
3.If you want to uncritically accept everything done by IR or any other composer, you go ahead. I don't do that with anybody and don't need your unsolicited advice. Yes, the composer is entitled to his decisions and I as the listener to my preferences, simple as that. Mostly, it is subconscious so your asking me to check my subconscious reactions to the music is unfeasible.
Wow..
you are way off tangent.. I don't intend to question the popularity of rukkumani rukkumani - provided that is the max that ARR could come up to for an erotic situation. are you suggesting that popularity is the benchmark of quality here? if so what is 'quality'? mere technical finesse and package can be counted as quality from a 'production process' stand point (like the QC OK sticker in the bottom of a mixie). For a listener to evolve into 'art appreciation' ,these are very minuscule elements that make up 'Quality'. In Raaja's music, I look for his 'harmony', ' intricacy', 'appropriateness to dramatic context', 'addition to genre material or elevation of chosen genre', 'expression of artist/creator's individuality' - If one looks at the output of Raaja through 90s and 2000s one is bound to find that the 'popularity' and 'crispness of sound engineering' , 'product packaging', 'media hyping' have added the element of bias against Raaja's music heavily. Devoid of all that, one finds that even in a heavily synth laden work of shiva sainya (kannada) Raaja packs enough of his experimental stuff of high 'integral quality' in it. If you haven't observed his music from that angle, then what vijay or yours truly say is bound to irritate you. My unsolicited advice is for anyone reading these pages as long as they live in the cyberspace, Do not approach Raaja's music from your chair with arm rests like you do of any other music director, for you are bound to eat back your words upon a different time, different circumstance when the real essence of the music opens to you when you have thrown away 'music critic' hat and are totally unguarded. Then you might not have this forum or me to listen to your admission (not that I am keen on listening to it).

I never said I equated popularity to quality and I think my point is pretty crystal clear if you actually read ONLY the words I used instead of trying so hard to repeatedly infer an agenda behind them. So here is my unsolicited advice to you - and I am really not going to bother responding to the rest of it - first try to understand what is written before responding. It may only take a minute to react but that does not mean your reaction is accurate. That's all. I am done with this. I have clarified my position enough and am under no obligation to explain MYSELF or MY musical creed. I thought we already knew but if you want to behave like a bhakt and call everything into question, go ahead, what difference does it make to me. I only find it amusing.

Be clear about what you want to convey. I am merely helping you clarify yourself.
In a post where you are supposed to speak "quality", you had to bring in a needless needle "but I have seen thathas and paatis humming Rukmani at the time, so widespread was its appeal. Now were they all paid by Vairam or KB to do so?" This is a veiled attempt to paint me and idiots like me as "bhakts" which you followed up to complete in your next post. This is the problem with your original post on Rangar blog too. It went on all fours in all directions, trying to tie up bald head and a naked knee. This is what confused everyone and caused 'unexpected' reactions from all sides. In future
write out the central conceits and supporting evidence in bullet points. Once you are convinced that the points flow out clear, remove the bullet points and absorb it into a paragraph(s) and sections . This was taught to me in high school by a wonderful english teacher.

jaiganesh Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:22 pm

@ CK - as far as sub conscious reactions to music is concerned, it is sub conscious only till you start writing about it. When you write about it, then there are three ways it can flow.
1. your visceral reaction, aspects unrelated to music that got triggered - these form the part of nostalgia that people associate with music. Generally listener is not in any particular mood to observe the music.
2. emotional reaction - probably the context of the music, the concept of it and the context of the listener - this is what we see as so many people reacting to some forms of music as relaxing or cathartic.
3. cognitive reaction - here the listener has chosen to place himself/herself to keep the senses fully tuned to the music - A full on observation of music - as it happens in concert halls.

So sometimes as a practitioner of meditation or sadhak would do, it is very important to understand the 'nature of observation' one is observing at any given moment - This mindfulness is very essential to transcend the 'listening experience' into a form of 'meditation' wherein newer aspects of music become visible suddenly. I have felt this 'trance' element in raaja's music (being a certified bhakt now ;-) ) in many of his songs from the so called 'unpopular' phase, but totally missing in the much celebrated NEPV.
Listen, but listen with the mindfulness.

crimson king Sat Apr 29, 2017 4:29 am

^^^ Did you not get the memo, mister? I am done. So if you want to keep barking to a wall, you may please carry on. You will not get any further responses from me on this topic.

kameshratnam Sat Apr 29, 2017 6:33 pm

app_engine wrote:Looks like Vijay Yesudass had learnt something from the twitter conversation he had with "mafia"

See this interview:

http://cinema.dinamalar.com/tamil-news/58703/cinema/Kollywood/vijay-yesudas-likes-actress-trisha.htm

He said IR Fans listen to free mp3 and i countered him with the fact that we have been asking tharangenee to release an audio cd pack of IR- tharangenee hits and his manager just refused to do it.. He accepted his mistake and took back his words and said " More power to you IR fans"

jaiganesh Mon May 01, 2017 12:07 am

crimson king wrote:^^^ Did you not get the memo, mister? I am done. So if you want to keep barking to a wall, you may please carry on. You will not get any further responses from me on this topic.

so now i am a dog? Good influence your listening has on you.. pity.. sigh pale

app_engine Mon May 01, 2017 5:38 pm

IR's sarcasm on the political situation of TN :
http://tamil.oneindia.com/news/tamilnadu/ilayaraja-commented-over-tn-government-s-functionary-281238.html

Laughing

app_engine Mon May 01, 2017 5:39 pm

IR inviting "kavikkO" Abdul Rahman to write for his music:
http://nakkheeran.in/users/frmNews.aspx?N=190307

app_engine Mon May 01, 2017 5:48 pm

Well, both the above posts happened in a felicitation to Muthulingam, see the news report by Hindu paper :
http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/chennai/muthulingams-language-is-like-a-lifelong-prayer-ilayaraja/article18284015.ece

BTW, please read the first comment below.

app_engine Mon May 01, 2017 6:02 pm

An article which tries to paint an objective portrayal of K Viswanath (who got Dadasaheb Palke award this year):
http://www.thenewsminute.com/article/blending-entertainment-social-messaging-telugu-blockbusters-k-vishwanath-way-61309

Portion relevant to this thread :

In ‘Sagara Sangamam’ again, Viswanath could score a hit largely due to the musical genius of composer Ilaiyaraja which not only set the tempo for the film but also lifted the proceedings to an appreciable level.

panniapurathar Mon May 01, 2017 7:13 pm

Kaviko speech about IR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YOu_3-aMPo

This is in the same venue app sir mentions above

app_engine Mon May 01, 2017 8:26 pm

panniapurathar wrote:Kaviko speech about IR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YOu_3-aMPo

This is in the same venue app sir mentions above

பகிர்ந்ததற்கு மிக்க நன்றி சார்!

என்னென்ன பாராட்டுக்கள்!

- கண்ணதாசன் போல இளையராஜாவும் மீன் விற்கும் சந்தையிலே விண்மீன்கள் விற்கிறவர்.

- இளையராஜா விருதுகள் வாங்கக்கூடியவர் அல்ல - வழங்கக்கூடியவர்.

- நல்ல வேளை இளையராஜா பாடலாசிரியராக வரலை - நிறையப்பேருக்கு வேலை போயிருக்கும்

the clap

panniapurathar Mon May 01, 2017 8:30 pm

Please watch this one also - Kavignar Muthulingam talks about iR. He talks about IR's Tamil knowledge. Also, he openly admits that there are many songs that came out in his name that had IR's lyrics (the beginning Pallavi)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r20PZlTCC1g

And, of course, our beloved Maestro:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wyaHW_fJG8

What I see in our IR's speech is his unbounded love of art in all it's forms. Look at his humility in requesting to set Kaviko's words to music!! Thirdly, note his infectious enthusiasm and pure joy - I keep saying this again and again - we are indeed fortunate to have this Being in our midst. I wish an album does come out of a collaboration between Kaviko and IR.

jaiganesh Tue May 02, 2017 9:50 am

+1 pp!

app_engine Tue May 02, 2017 5:27 pm

Part 6 of "why celebrate IR" series in patrikai.com :
https://www.patrikai.com/why-should-celebrate-ilayaraja-series-6-child-of-the-time-niyohi/

kiru Wed May 03, 2017 9:42 am

That function was an interesting watch. Like minded experts talking and a very knowledgeable/appreciate audience. IR was in his elements and his prowess in music (singing) and literature in full display. I think this is the reason (his tamil expertise) that he gets upset when some lyricists tried to shoebox him into the purely music role and ask to be given full freedom in their lyrics domain. I think he just wants to be treated like a co-worker in the lyrics domain as well. If they treat him as a fellow professional it would be an easy working relationship with him. (I am delighted to hear that - aarum athu aazham illai pallavi is from him - this is the reason I guess his songs have an organic holistic quality to them - All those young modern musicians who want to mimic the white people should understand ..all those american/english bands write their own lyrics).

Usha Wed May 03, 2017 2:21 pm

Thanks for the videos........

IR.. Thannilai vilakkam. enna oru unmai.

kavikovai... ungalai paatu ezhudha vaipadharkaga sollavillai. Nyayamana oru unarvai velipaduthugiren......

ammi kalla.. sirpama.. enna oru Nalinam.....

cinema padalai thangal..kaviko neengal.. thara koraivaga ninaikadheergal. enna oru vaarthai.....

asai theera.. oru kaviko kavidhai.

suttu viral pola adhai neeta koodadha
panam thirudavargalai kaatta kudadha

idhu ammiya.. \

ipo veru oru tune.,

idhu sirpama......

kaviko.. ungalai nesipadhal... ellor ariya ipadi solli kolgiren....

ungal mel kurai endral.. thaniyaga than pesi iruka vendum.. naalu per ariya pesugiravan naan alla......

urimaiyil dhan pesugiren. neengal thavaraga eduthu kolla matergal endru enaku nanraga theiryum. endru solli vittu

aiya endru oru pasamana parvaiyodu oru vanakkam.

manam negizhndhu ponen..... idhu dhanae indha IR.. idhai yen unara mudiyavillai.........

kaviko azhagaga sonnar.. IRai Tamil nadu purindhu kollavillai.. cinemavirku ithanai arivu thevai ilai...........

pasamana oru nigazhchi...........

crimson king Wed May 03, 2017 7:26 pm

kiru wrote:That function was an interesting watch. Like minded experts talking and a very knowledgeable/appreciate audience. IR was in his elements and his prowess in music (singing) and literature in full display. I think this is the reason (his tamil expertise) that he gets upset when some lyricists tried to shoebox him into the purely music role and ask to be given full freedom in their lyrics domain. I think he just wants to be treated like a co-worker in the lyrics domain as well. If they treat him as a fellow professional it would be an easy working relationship with him. (I am delighted to hear that - aarum athu aazham illai pallavi is from him - this is the reason I guess his songs have an organic holistic quality to them - All those young modern musicians who want to mimic the white people should understand ..all those american/english bands write their own lyrics).

Maybe the lyricists (still) resent the loss of stature post the decline and eventual demise of Kannadasan combined with the simultaneous rise of IR. Vairam said pretty much to that effect in an interview, hailing the 60s as the golden age of poetry. It is not unusual in Bollywood for directors or music directors to have suggested one or two lines of lyrics from which the lyricist worked out the stanzas, so what may be projected as interference in TFM is fairly routine in Bollywood. But in Bollywood, you never had either lyricist or music director attaining disproportionately high stature at the expense of one another. Lyricists tended to be somewhat subordinate to music directors but the importance of good lyrics was understood at least in the golden era and there are still good lyricists like Amitabh Bhattacharya. There is a perpetual avanga v/s ivanga in many aspects of TF which I don't really understand. Maybe it is like that in Bolly but they are more savvy operators and keep things politically correct in public.

Re American/English bands writing their own lyrics, what tends to happen is either the lyrics or the music suffer or maybe some bands manage to attain a balance of both (Pink Floyd is the best example but again lyrics aficionados would sneer at their lyrics and compare them unfavourably to Dylan while musicos think they are too banal compared to Yes or King Crimson). King Crimson for a while had Peter Sinfeld and Renaissance had Betty Thatcher just to contribute lyrics. So that kind of experiment has been attempted even in rock.

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