Anything about IR found on the net - Vol 2

Yes, I have not said either that his essential process somehow changed in the 90s. At the same time, I would not like to eliminate the role of external stimuli completely.  It is quite possible that competition pinched him and spurred him to challenge himself a little more.  Likewise even in the late 70s, who knows if Ninaithale Innikkum pushed him to raise his game some more to where nobody could get him.  The elements of the 80s era were already falling in place circa Ilamayenum Poongatru.  Just the finishing touch was required. IR may revere MSV but that doesn't mean he would not want at all to beat him in the game.  Sebastian Vettel had to lap Schumi in the race, he didn't have a choice.

plum wrote:...
Yet, our Balu Mahendra did. And that too, when he felt that "while thevar magan deserved it, I wanted to encourage the youngster"
...

Isn't it interesting that IR is still friendly with BM ? Maybe it is the respect for BM's talent which makes him ignore his actions and/or tells about his desire for awards !!!
BTW, while you guys fight out the 'hit rate' , I do feel IR's 'hit rate' will be much lower than Rahman !!! And you guys know why I dont care about this :-)
RE: Gibran .. I dont know who this MD is - but this is a welcome trend.

Annamayya was in the following year, Wiz.

My mistake, SPB in one of his recent shows lamented at not getting an national award for 'Annamayya' and that sorrow superseded the joy
of getting it for 'Thanga tharmarai' so put 2 in 2

And it won against..."GURU"!!!!

Greek tragedy

Not just Tamil .....

mindboggling body of work if we add JVAS,Aakhari Porattam,Nirnayam,Rakthabisekam to that list it could be a perfect noob's guide to Raaja in Telugu. for people whining about sound quality should lend their ears to those Aditya cds. looking at the volume of work seems like we may as well borrow Einstein's quote on Gandhi   

You are quoting me out of context hereI said

apologies thought you were on about his 90s music. my pet peeve with '80s Yay/90s Nay' fans is that they didn't even give these songs a fair trail and were quick to jump the gun.

If A R Rahman cannot work like Ilayaraja, there is no point in pretending to.

then AR/his fans should wake up to the fact AR was never really prolific and should never hide behind the veil that ' only the best music ought to leave the studio' even if it takes months which is nothing but a marketing crap like what Bose used/still claim that they produce the best sound and never quantify them with tech data sheets.

If the IR of Konji Konji was indeed the same IR of the 80s and 70s, I might have found it much more difficult to get into his music.  There is something striking about that intrusive, banal beat.  Even contextualising it as a rough approximation of a club class band doesn't work for me.  What I am talking about has nothing to do with recording or budget, it is just how the beat has been programmed. I find the Konji Konji beat very uncharacteristic of IR.

now you are nitpicking would you judge AR's use of synths just from 'Parasuram'? may be Raaja thought banal beats were par for the course
given RK's rural background and that was his first performance in an urban setup.

At the same time, I would not like to eliminate the role of external stimuli completely.  It is quite possible that competition pinched him and spurred him to challenge himself a little more.

given you got into Raaja only after 'Singaravelan' do this homework, take couple of years before and after AR came into the scene and tell me Raaja needed any Stimuli/Challenge or whatever you wish to call them.

I guess this is a debate which will keep continuing  And everyone knows my stand (which is also documented in my blog) So will not repeat myself.

Just have a look at this playlist which is mostly 2000s based (maybe one or two late 90s but no 70s or 80s or early 90s) I have just picked up songs randomly based on the theme that they sound soothing and we can listen to them late at night. Being soft and melodious was my criteria. Check out the songs and you can see the huge variety in them. This is the 2000s where Raja's commercial non-viability was well known and there was no real 'beat the competition' anymore. Yet see how much variety Raja gives in this small sub genre. So if consider his complete output the variety is mind boggling, from the very melodious 'Mallepoovu' all the way to the grand 'Pazhassiraja' with something like a rock/jazz classic "NEPV' thrown into the mix. Just the analysis of 2000s songs will make it clear that Raja always fights with himself to shed off old skin and put on new skin. In that way he is a 'Naga Raja'  while others are like lizards, which lose their tails because someone is holding it and they are in danger

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nK-vdpGZybE&list=PLSv5Q60S5dwS0Qld7P7e2Lo-3BXmd08AD

So go ahead and watch this. Even if you don't agree with me, you will atleast sleep peacefully

Wizzy,

Ghibran crediting loops  Plum tweeted that and alerted me.

I still remember a fight in the old forum wherein I had asked one ARR fan that when people go ga-ga over him crediting someone who has played for only 15 secs why can't they credit the loops used? My argument was that it told us clearly what was store bought and what the composer did and would allow us to assess the contribution of the MC more clearly. Now that Ghibran has done this let us wait and see what the reaction from ARR camp is.

Lot of serious discussions in this thread, so time for some comic relief

Mani Ratnam approached Mahesh Babu...

 It is rumored that the movie will be based on ‘Ponnian Selvan’ and it will be made in Tamil and Telugu languages on Madras Talkies banner.  Budget of the movie is going to be Rs. 200 crores.  Vikram will be the hero for Tamil version.  ‘Ponnial Selvan’ novel is written by Kalki.  It is also rumored that Ilayaraja and AR Rahman will be the music directors of the film and there will be three heroines.  Mani Ratnam is rumored to have said that the movie will be completed in 15 – 20 months but the movie may not be completed that soon.  Take this information with a pinch of salt as nothing is officially confirmed.

 

T Sounder's next rAgA article, on chArukEsi

இங்கே எத்தனை இசைமேதைகள எத்தனை விதமாக சாருகேசி ராகத்தில் தந்த பாடல்களில் மனம் சொக்கிய நாம் , இதற்க்கு மேலும் ஒரு கற்பனை வளம் இருக்குமா என்று எண்ணத் தக்க வகையிலும் திகைக்கும் வண்ணமும் பாடல்கள் தந்து சென்றுள்ளார்கள்.

இந்த ஆச்சரியங்களை எல்லாம் ஒரு நொடியில் தவிடு பொடியாக்கியது போல மக்கள் இசை என்னும் நாட்டுப்புற இசையின் பாதிப்பிலிருந்து பிறந்தது ஒரு இசையருவி.மலையில் உருவாகும் அருவி சுழித்து வேகத்துடன் வருவது போல , துணிவுடன் புறப்பட்ட இசையருவி நம் இசை வாழ்வையே மாற்றியது.அது மரபையும் நவீனததையும் பிணைத்து அந்நிய இசை உறவுமுறைகளில் மன அதிர்ச்சி தந்து புண்ணாக்காமல் , மாறாக பிற மக்களின் இனிய பண்புகளில் இழையோடிக்கிடக்கும் இசைச் சிறப்புக்களை எல்லாம் , முன்னோர்களிடமிருந்து வாரிசுரிமையாகப் பெற்ற இசைச் செல்வங்களுடன் இணைத்து இசையில் புதிய தரிசனங்களை தொட்டுக்காட்டி பாமரர்களை மட்டுமல்ல பண்டிதர்களையும் வியக்க வைத்தது.அந்த இசையருவி அன்னக்கிளி என்ற மலை முகட்டிலிருந்து இறங்கியது.இசையருவி தந்த சாருகேசி ராகப்பாடல்களை இனி பார்ப்போம்

Wizzy wrote:

fring151 wrote:

wizzy wrote:

Between 93 and 2000, ARR was consistently averaging 3-4 great albums and 5-10 brilliant songs a year.

AR probably did as many movies per year, appo  ellame great albums'a, hyperbole much?

Saar, as someone who insists on rigour and accuracy in formulating arguments and generally cautious about throwing around numbers, I take offense to that.

Let's agree "consistently between 93 and 2000" = at least in 5 of those 8 years. Here goes:

93 - Gentleman, Thiruda thiruda, Pudhiya mugam
94 - Kaadhalan, May Madham, Duet .(Could also include Karuthamma, but I have already attained my targeted lower limit of 3 and will let it pass)
95- Bombay, Rangeela, Muthu, Indira
96 - Kadhal desam, Minsara kanavu, Indian, Love birds
2000 - Kandukondein, Alaipayuthey, Rhythm

There! Desired number reached. Now personal opinions may differ on whether these albums can be called "Great", but they are all generally agreed upon as very very good soundtracks by most music lovers.

very very good != great

clearly we have different definition on what constitutes a great album. If this is the benchmark for an great album it's safe to conclude Raaja's supposedly lower strike rate was still better than his challenger's career best 

I take it you are questioning the merits of the highlighted albums. If that is the case, I could concede that Muthu, Indian and Love birds might not really qualify as great, especially Muthu. But I am somewhat surprised at your reluctance to accept some of the others, particularly KAdhal desam and MinsAra poove. Ok, granted I have indeed changed my benchmark for "great" when it comes to ARR, but come on, if we keep Nenjathai Killadhe or Salangai Oli as the universal reference point for greatness, very few albums of any MD, past or present can come close. So within ARR's scope and territory, I still think these can be called great, or if you are uncomfortable with that adjective, definitely very very good. 

plum wrote:Secondly, even in 80s if I list all 52 movies of 1984 for instance, I dont imagine Aakarsh/Fring would classify more than 15 as absolute greats. That is not a great strike rate, either.

Perhaps yes, but I don't really approach IR's music on a movie-by-movie basis. I once made a list of songs from the 80-83 that I consider "great", strictly by IR standards this time, and in all those years the list ran into the 30s and 40s (IIRC even 50s for one of those years) and I would rate a good percentage of them as masterpieces too. I doubt my 90s list would be similar.

crimson king wrote:Yes, I have not said either that his essential process somehow changed in the 90s. At the same time, I would not like to eliminate the role of external stimuli completely.  It is quite possible that competition pinched him and spurred him to challenge himself a little more.  Likewise even in the late 70s, who knows if Ninaithale Innikkum pushed him to raise his game some more to where nobody could get him.  The elements of the 80s era were already falling in place circa Ilamayenum Poongatru.  Just the finishing touch was required. IR may revere MSV but that doesn't mean he would not want at all to beat him in the game.  Sebastian Vettel had to lap Schumi in the race, he didn't have a choice.

Even before Pagalil oru iravu or Ninaithale inikkum (both 1979 releases according to wiki), Sigappu rojakkal - 1978 - was complete with elaborate orchestration, brilliant chords and westernized vocals both in the songs and BGM. I have wondered if this was his first full-fledged foray into that territory. "En kanmani" (again 1978), by IR's own account  was the first song that he experimented with vocal counterpoint. Likewise "Senthoora poove" (1977) had great arrangement of strings, but am I right that "SR" was the first movie where he really decided to take the full plunge?

fring151 wrote:but am I right that "SR" was the first movie where he really decided to take the full plunge?

'vizhilyilE malarndhadhu' of BoK (1977) had that terrific 40+ violins thingy for the 2nd interlude; that was much talked about those days...

app_engine wrote:

fring151 wrote:but am I right that "SR" was the first movie where he really decided to take the full plunge?

'vizhilyilE malarndhadhu' of BoK (1977) had that terrific 40+ violins thingy for the 2nd interlude; that was much talked about those days...

Ah yes, who can forget that song! But I think "Raja enbar" and "Poo thendrale" from BoK are still "Very 70s" and show shades of MSV and earlier HFM (Poo thendrale) - unlike "Ninaivo oru paravai" and "Indha minminikku" The BGM also possibly contains IR's earliest use of wah-wah effects. That's why I am curious if it is considered a landmark album in IR's career and TFM history and if this has been discussed in the hub before.

"
then AR/his fans should wake up to the fact AR was never really prolific and should never hide behind the veil that ' only the best music ought to leave the studio' even if it takes months"


They are not necessarily wrong.  It perhaps does take THAT long for Rahman to give HIS best to a soundtrack.  Where I differ with them is in believing that IR is somehow egoistic or arrogant or lackadaisical for wrapping up soundtracks quickly.  That is the same approach he has used for Mouna Raagam or Chinna Thambi so the approach is not the issue.


"
now you are nitpicking would you judge AR's use of synths just from 'Parasuram'? may be Raaja thought banal beats were par for the course
given RK's rural background and that was his first performance in an urban setup. "


Why do you jump to the conclusion that I am basing that conclusion only on one song.  That is one example and there are others I can point out from the 90s.  I have tried to contextualise it in n number of ways just as you suggested one way and even in terms of realism, those kind of beats stretch it too far.


"given you got into Raaja only after 'Singaravelan' do this homework, take couple of years before and after AR came into the scene and tell me Raaja needed any Stimuli/Challenge or whatever you wish to call them."



I got into Raja with Singaravelan AS THE FILM RELEASED -  1992.  I have kept in touch with his music since that time and I only became deeply interested in his 80s music from 99/00 onwards. I don't need to do any 'homework' on his music but thank you for being condescending.  In terms of attention to production values and minor details like Konji Koni above, I find that in several songs he let things pass during that period.  From around mid 90s, he began to explore a different direction and I don't really have significant issues with the recordings that I have heard from this period and onwards.

plumAakarsh - I don't want to give you an impression that I am questioning your taste. Far from it. For someone of your background, to be even interested in Raja's 80s and 90s output in TAMIL, is unusual.

I know I make a big deal of the respect telugu folks give to Raja even today but honestly, that is purely based on his output in Telugu. The HCIRF who straddle languages and follow Raja is not huge. 
In that sense, I am thankful that fans like you exist in telugudesam.

Disclaimer out, let's proceed to explain my stance.

I still maintain that if you really listed out the 80s output, the proportion of Raja songs you like may not be that different.
I'd explain this further:
1. You like 15/100 songs in 90s, very likely you'll classify only 15-20/100 as great even in the 80s
2. I probably like a bigger proportion in 90s, but I just think that my likes of 80s output would be of similar proportion
3. Raaga_Suresh likes 100% of Raja's output in 90s. He, I surmise, likes 100% of 80s raja output  (as Dagalti famously dubbed him, "avaru oodhavE vENAm")

That is, IR is IR, He is the same. Our prism of seeing him seems to be varying (in your case), a bit from 30000ft level (in my case)
(In other words, he continues to follow the same process as he ever did. My reckoning is mathematically, a person reacting to his 90s output in a certain manner, will have a similar reaction to th e80s output in same proportion. Now, I am talking of serious listeners like Aakarsh, not the average jothilingam)
I wonder how much you like the "ponna pOla AthA enna pethu pOttA" "jingidi jingidi onakku" type songs from 80s. The answer to that might help me further in my theorizing.


The thing with IR is, he doesn't curate, compile or pickle it and release it after 6 months like ARR does, That is, there is no Quality Assurance, or Quality Control process. (this being my line of job now, I would be out of job with IR like programmers in IT. Thankfully, I reckon nobody like IR exists in IT). It's like, the client gives the requirement, IR writes the code then and there, and the recording process is just compiling and executing. 

While I - and Suresh - would like to claim that in each of his 950 movies, the output was *exactly* as the client needed it, that may, of course, be exaggeration. There are masala movies where the director has no idea, the script has no particular emotion to express, and in those songs, yes, there is no way we can claim the script deserved exactly that song. But, to a large extent, if the script and/or the director needed a specific emotion and viewpoint, I rather believe IR expressed it *perfectly* 100% of the time such a requirement was there.

At the same time, in those other situations and movies where there was no need to stick to a script/emotion, I think IR did his experimentation, and not all of these may be perfect. Unfortunately, my tiny brain can't think of an example of an idea being experimented in FlopSong A, and then developed and perfected in SuperHit Song B later. I reckon Suresh can give that example. Or, I could take a shortcut and point to NEPV as the culmination of IR's ideas and experimentation in the recent times.(a few flop songs for previous few years - that maybe suresh and I liked but didnt stand out like NEPV like a force of nature, and those ideas culminating in the tour de force that was NEPV)

That is why, I say, if you dig deep into 80s, you'll hear all those pre-perfect ideas of songs, which I am predicting that will lead to a same proportion of likes/dislikes as you have for IR's output in 90s.

I guess we are repeating ourselves here.

I agree with everything you wrote above and I am not at all questioning it. Especially the fact that Raaja adheres to the script and the emotion (as narrated to him by the director). I am one of those guys who agrees that Raaja's output is heavily correlated to the script, director's vision. And in that sense, I believe that he had/has the capability to marry the script to music... And hence, no need to elaborate or argue about that.

My point is about how I opened up to Raaja's music and how the experience varied. And i stressed before - that probably (my guess), the experience is similar to lot of people... at least the people around me reveal similar experience. A subtle difference between them & me is that I might still venture out and try listening a whole album twice or thrice, before dismissing while some people might dismiss it when they dont like it in first listening. 

My expsoure to Raaja's music was extremely limited (limited to about 20 odd telugu film tapes + his 2 instrumental albums) till 2002. So you can say, I missed out the whole 90s. In 2003, a friend of mine exposed me to about 100 songs of Raaja, spanning 80s & 90s. then in 2004-05 period, i treated myself to lot of raaja output, mainly from tamil tv channels, some raaja fans, musicindiaonline, raaga.com, dhool.com etc. this output ranged from 80s-90s and post 2000 era. And the general feeling i got was that the music had distinct flavours in each era. the pre-80s was of certain kind. 80s was of different kind. (mid)90s again different and post-2000, again different. Mind you, the ideas are same. the techniques are same. the school of thought is same. but still there was some variance.. in choice of instruments, arrangements, sound etc. and i found myself to be heavily drawn towards 80s output and post-2000 output more. It is not that i did not like 90s output. But unknowingly, i found that the no. of songs that impressed me a lot are more from these periods while from 90s, i liked some albums like Guru, Kaalapani etc.

So, if you can see, my exposure to raaja's music was not based on the initial hype (of 80s or 90s or whatever). I pretty much discovered nearly 70% of his output at the same time and - call it my musical preference or whatever - the 80s and post 2000 used to impress me a lot more. 

Then, Raaga_Suresh's digging the 90s was a huge eye-opener. I discovered many wonderful 90s songs which i didnt listen to before. And for every song he posted, i listened to the whole film. And thats how i embarked upon the idea of objectively listening to 90s albums, in year-wise fashion. my objective was to understand the transition of Raaja from 80s to post-2000 (which i got to like). I was trying to identify a pattern. 

But the way 90s music opened to me was different. When i was discovering 80s, i almost came to conclusion that every song he gave was a damn good song. It is probably the sample set i choose or whatever. but the journey of discovery blew my mind. Now, something like that dd not happen - that consistently - when i was digging through 90s. Of course, some songs of 90s too blew me away. but, along with them came some songs which did not necessarily give me the same experience.

It is out of this experience that I was coming from.

I know that Raaja was/is still the same (how can one change overnight?). I also agree that Raaja did not have any challenge in early 80s, that he changed gears at that time.Possible. 

But when I saw that the 90s exactly did not give me same high/expeirience (to that highest degree of 80s) as pre 80s, 80s (exceptions exist in every year in 90s too, as digged out by Suresh and also as I myself continue to discover more) and when i see the bigger pattern of an onslaught of certain themed (musically) films in 90s (where i felt monotonity).. like say Chinna Tmabi and all (which btw, is an unimpressive album for 'me')... and then slowly the pattern changes to some strong synth laden albums (sambhu etc), i just wonder if the shift to synth if deliberate or market forces!!! (again plz dont come back saying that raaja was using synth earlier.. i know.. but here what i mean is different).

Its a strange curve actually.. his synth dependence peaked from late 90s to post-2000 and then, again in the last 6-7 years, i feel it came down and stabilized at a certain level (almost like a product maturity curve).

As for ARR, his curating and all that - agree. no point discussing, when in agreement.

And my guess is also a function of some raaja fans I interacted with over the last 10 years (people who tend to like his 80s output and post 2005 output more while have some selective likes across 90s. And no, they are not arr fans).

Anyway, this discussion is endless. Perhaps this post of mine gives more clarity on where i am coming from. and also, ultimately it is all about preferences too.. what we naturally get to like.

Well ..production values are low in synth driven albums of IR. With the synth stuff the sound is 'dry' and it needs some 'reverb' / 'effects' to be added. I am pretty sure Rahman has spent tons of money on software and personally does or supervises the mixing. IR does not get involved in it that much and the team does not translate his vision very well. It is better he does it with real instruments, where it is only a matter of 'recording' and 'mixing' (even here there could be some processing involved) But with acoustic recording IR has better visibility into the final output. Anyways, this is what he does for serious albums and the final sound is awesome. But we dont get all albums of IR like this :-( .. Anyways, life is full of compromises... I will take artistic value over sound engineering perfection.
I do appreciate Rahman for ensuring very good production quality on his albums. Even his buddy Srinivas's new film kangaroo has good sound engineering.

Add to that - his Malayalam repertoire, which is a whole different ball game altogether and I discovered that too in mid 2005 i think. And i loved it more... more than some of the tamil albums in 90s. Not at all questioning raaja's faithful adherence to script. it is purely about what I tended to like more.

kiruWell ..production values are low in synth driven albums of IR. With the synth stuff the sound is 'dry' and it needs some 'reverb' / 'effects' to be added. I am pretty sure Rahman has spent tons of money on software and personally does or supervises the mixing. IR does not get involved in it that much and the team does not translate his vision very well. It is better he does it with real instruments, where it is only a matter of 'recording' and 'mixing' (even here there could be some processing involved) But with acoustic recording IR has better visibility into the final output. Anyways, this is what he does for serious albums and the final sound is awesome. But we dont get all albums of IR like this :-(  .. Anyways, life is full of compromises... I will take artistic value over sound engineering perfection.
I do appreciate Rahman for ensuring very good production quality on his albums. Even his buddy Srinivas's new film kangaroo has good sound engineering.

I understand. But then, reasons do not come as preface, before the experience of listening to a raaja's song right. Ultimately the listening experience is what that matters. reasons are merely a post-mortem, no matter how valid they are. If I need to play a certain song to someone, i received a quick reply many times - "do you have good quality version, the recording quality seems poor".

And experience matters, at some point or other, because it was raaja (and R.D.Burman) who first spoilt me on this. I would have cared a damn if Raaja, right from onset, dished out mediocre recording quality. He elevated it significantly and made me appreciate, experience nuances. Almost as if both I and raaja travelling together on that "quality improvement curve" and suddenly, he stops walking (in 90s).

I am really glad that things again changed in the last 7-8 years. 

Of course, i must stress that I am so used to raaja's music now, that i have trained my ears to listen to these compromises normally. But objectively, i still have that "if only..." thought when I listen to any good song with bad quality.

Raaga_Suresh wrote:Wizzy,

Ghibran crediting loops  Plum tweeted that and alerted me.

I still remember a fight in the old forum wherein I had asked one ARR fan that when people go ga-ga over him crediting someone who has played for only 15 secs why can't they credit the loops used? My argument was that it told us clearly what was store bought and what the composer did and would allow us to assess the contribution of the MC more clearly. Now that Ghibran has done this let us wait and see what the reaction from ARR camp is.

this was really out of the blue, does recent changes in copyright law mandates MDs
to name their sources? AR who is gung ho about IP rights should follow suit though it must
be heartwrenching for his fans whose lifetime endeavor was to flaunt about these very loops/samples.
we could only hope it puts an end to Sound Engineer turned MDs like Vijay Antony,Taj Noor and their ilk.


CK, I wasn't condescending, since you were on about banal beats,want you to listen to his works from the said period so we are on the same page.for many fans that period is still uncharted territory. unlike other MD fans who could say they got listen to entire repertoire..
Raaja's repertoire is so vast that its next to impossible for any of his fans to say so. for instance KV here got me hooked into some of 70s Raaja+GKV works from then on sweet sambhar never tasted so sweet. it might be tad tiring going through it but can assure you that it will be an enriching experience.

Wizzy wrote:




Raaja's repertoire is so vast that its next to impossible for any of his fans to say so.

 I agree on this.

wizzy: But I never said he used banal beats in ALL 90s songs, never would when I do love lots of his 90s songs. Pl remember that I did not see the Ilayaraja no.1, 2, 3,4 days. Singaravelan was maybe the outer end of that phase. So I liked songs like Nil nil nil or Thendral vanthu thoongom as they were, without comparing them to the 80s. But my impressions of his possible fatigue have been formed by other tracks, including but not restricted to some big name disappointments like my dear marthandan, uzhaipaali, rasaiyya (except kadhal vanile). That impression is not going change only by listening to great tracks that slipped by.

Raaga_Suresh wrote:I guess this is a debate which will keep continuing  And everyone knows my stand (which is also documented in my blog) So will not repeat myself.

Just have a look at this playlist which is mostly 2000s based (maybe one or two late 90s but no 70s or 80s or early 90s) I have just picked up songs randomly based on the theme that they sound soothing and we can listen to them late at night. Being soft and melodious was my criteria. Check out the songs and you can see the huge variety in them. This is the 2000s where Raja's commercial non-viability was well known and there was no real 'beat the competition' anymore. Yet see how much variety Raja gives in this small sub genre. So if consider his complete output the variety is mind boggling, from the very melodious 'Mallepoovu' all the way to the grand 'Pazhassiraja' with something like a rock/jazz classic "NEPV' thrown into the mix. Just the analysis of 2000s songs will make it clear that Raja always fights with himself to shed off old skin and put on new skin. In that way he is a 'Naga Raja'  while others are like lizards, which lose their tails because someone is holding it and they are in danger

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nK-vdpGZybE&list=PLSv5Q60S5dwS0Qld7P7e2Lo-3BXmd08AD

So go ahead and watch this. Even if you don't agree with me, you will atleast sleep peacefully

 Nice playlist. Saves time/effort for me today. Badly needed something while working in office today (no, i do not sleep in office).

My latest on Raja blog. Parallel Processing of Raja. Both from 2009 and show in what superb form he is in. These two songs will take on any 70s or 80s songs and will come out the winner

http://onlyraja.wordpress.com/2014/01/14/parallel-processing-of-raja/

Raaga_Suresh wrote:http://onlyraja.wordpress.com/2014/01/14/parallel-processing-of-raja/

Fantastic Sureshji!

These two songs will take on any 70s or 80s songs and will come out the winner

Me, a certified "primarily-80's-IRF", has to agree to this

Well, in my case, the 80's inclination is purely nostalgia-based and not exactly IR-kwality based

(BTW, for a given circumstance , I can point out 100's of IR songs from 80's that didn't click with me   At present I'm catalog-ing 1986 TFM of IR, to get IR-VM hit list in the VM thread. And all I can see is just about 50% hit-rate by rAsA in that year, in TFM)

Interesting discussions in the last few pages.

Lot of references to 'an external factor or a stimuli'. I know what or who it is. It is not Rahman but Karthik Raaja. Yes, I attribute everything bad about (mid, late 90s) Raaja's music, particularly the sound to KR. And I know I am right.

And the only thing that differentiats his 80s output with the late 90s is the bassline. I mean I really miss the youthful exuberance of a megam kottattum, particularly the bassline. It has to partly do with the type of films he was working on too.

I really don't have any problems with his albums until say 97. Its only the period between 98 and naan kadavuL that I have not warmed up to. Luckily he hasnt done many movies in that period.

kamalaakarsh wrote:

continue to discover more) and when i see the bigger pattern of an onslaught of certain themed (musically) films in 90s (where i felt monotonity).. like say Chinna Tmabi and all (which btw, is an unimpressive album for 'me')... and then slowly the pattern changes to some strong synth laden albums (sambhu etc), i just wonder if the shift to synth if deliberate or market forces!!! (again plz dont come back saying that raaja was using synth earlier.. i know.. but here what i mean is different).

Wow.  Chinnathambi is def one of my folk favourites of IR.  Just the second interlude of Povomo Oorvolam is enough.  I am curious as to what folk based albums of his do you like, what kind of, etc.  I wonder if you like Periya Veetu Pannaikaaran (probably not if you didn't like CT).  I am quite a sucker for IR-folk, the only folk music I have ever really liked, though not as much as people like Suresh or plum.

ye lets blame it on KR   any list of songs/albums he had worked.. Aatma/Pandiyan aside anything else?

some big name disappointments like my dear marthandan

is this a typo? else