Raja's New Albums

^^^  Informative comment, thanks.  Will at least wait for Navin guy to upload the BGM of Kuttrame Thandanai, if nothing else.  Would definitely be interested to hear the intersection of Raja and Nine Inch Nails.

Worth a watch in theater to enjoy photography and expansive score.

If BRangan is not too happy with IR's BGM in KutramE Dhandanai.
it could be due to one of these :
Either IR is lacking in  catching up with the wavelength of these
new wave directors like VetrimAran or MaNikandan in transalating director's vision with a fresh dimension.
OR
These so called new age reviewers like BRangan or Karthik.S wallow in preconceived notion that Raja is still warped in 70's and 80's sensibilities and refuse to see that here is a versatile, septuagenarian genius who can adapt so adeptly to any director and gives the viewers the exact experience as required by the directors.
AFA OAK is concerned, this movie is high
on emotional content which got sugar coated and propped up as a thriller
for marketing reasons, perhaps and hence Raja also went all out for
dark, rich bg score that accentuated the atonement emotions of Myskin.
Janaranjaka pulp fiction lovers like me expected another "anjAdhE" type of thriller from Myskin and got disappointed .
BRangan, Karthik.S seem to have problem with most of the recent IR work so much so that, I cannot give them the benefit of doubt if they have a very condescending opinion about IR.

mythila wrote:AFA OAK is concerned, as Irfan commented, this movie is high
on emotional content which got sugar coated and propped up as a thriller
for marketing reasons, perhaps and hence Raja also went all out for
dark, rich bg score that accentuated the atonement emotions of Myskin.

Where did he say that?  If anything, he agreed with me that the score doesn't mesh with the film. Yes, the film has emotions but it is also very ambivalent and in that respect, lets the audience watch and form their judgments rather than thrusting its judgments on them in the way a regular mainstream film would. There is no clear cut us and them, naanga/neenga in OAK and the protagonist is made to realise that the real villain can often be circumstance. 

The thing  is the vocabulary of these sort of films are different from typical Tamil films.  They don't NEED such an evocative score as Raja gives.  I love Henry Mancini's scores but can't imagine him composing the score for French Connection.  He would feel so bored. Just today, I finally watched the much hyped Shiva/Udhayam.  I was told it is a cult classic.  I saw a merely half way decent film elevated by a magical back ground score.  That is the kind of film where Raja's score works best.  It has good intentions but at times is crude/lacks coherence and the score elevates these moments and conveys that which the director failed to express. Those films, like many others in the 80s, were as much Ilayaraja films as they were RGV/MR/as applicable films, maybe more so in some cases.  The things that Mani Ratnam does not convey in Mouna Raagam are filled up by the background score.  But such a strong theme is not needed in a film like OAK because that kind of makes it over communicative.  I don't want to know what I am supposed to be feeling at that particular point through a rich string section; that feels manipulative. Silence would in fact make the tension, the confusion even more palpable. 

That is my opinion and I can respect the fact that others may have a different view.  I do not respect the notion that this immediately implies such a view can only come from somebody biased against Raja and therefore in turn the view is to be disregarded.  Maybe B Rangan or Karthik don't like modern Raja very much at all but even so, it doesn't mean everything they say is invalid just because of who's saying it.

Folks, not sure how much you guys agree with me. IR will fail/has failed many times, but this is because he is doing his OWN stuff all the time. He is not improvising another european/american artiste for you. He is the most original guy we have. This is how genre's get made, but just like how history is made of people who have failed and then finally succeeded. IR has been practicing/learning music for a long time. Things get better everyday. I am not sure I can say that for many other people's work. So what if the BGM of this movie has flaws, just like how the other team members gave it a try, he has made an attempt as well. 
(The fact he did not ask the director who the first MD was - is very interesting. I am sure he knew but probably did not want to bring it up as he is purely focussed on getting things done rather than worrying about how much people love him .. anyways, I think he always loved the art rather than the creator).

kiru wrote:Folks, not sure how much you guys agree with me. IR will fail/has failed many times, but this is because he is doing his OWN stuff all the time. He is not improvising another european/american artiste for you. He is the most original guy we have. This is how genre's get made, but just like how history is made of people who have failed and then finally succeeded. IR has been practicing/learning music for a long time. Things get better everyday. I am not sure I can say that for many other people's work. So what if the BGM of this movie has flaws, just like how the other team members gave it a try, he has made an attempt as well. 
(The fact he did not ask the director who the first MD was - is very interesting. I am sure he knew but probably did not want to bring it up as he is purely focussed on getting things done rather than worrying about how much people love him .. anyways, I think he always loved the art rather than the creator).

This I completely agree with.  IR keeps trying something different.  Some experiments fail but even the failed experiments are later revisited and refined into success.

This interview is much clear (we don't have to assume anything based on the printed matter):

https://t.co/m7O8r0JKdb


The director clearly loved IR's working style

Any thoughts about :oru meliya koadu: that is being a thriller if not a classic but a simple movie.

crimson.. as far as OAK bgm not meshing with film it is only few parts i thought like that for that crying scene and few places where characters were walking in dark streets . but those long horns and fast paced bgm for metro station scene and thrilling scenes in subway tunnel train the violins and trumphets and drums play and travel along with those scenes..starting from him opening the glass door, running on steps, pausing turning, finally stopping when those hollow trumphets blow as if train is approaching.. .also there are other pieces for bad guys and climax scene with other instruments comes into play. raja simply elevates what is being presented front of us.(again that is just me and others might feel such bgm not necessary)

i did like this write up which explains more about the score especially the violin pieces.
 
https://onlyraja.wordpress.com/2013/10/14/the-music-of-onayum-aatukuttiyum-a-discourse/ 

most of the violin pieces i did not understand while watching the movie but just gives a different perspective of it. 

When myskin released the bgm cd all of it had only just violin pieces as if the whole movie had only that bgm which had mixes reviews and felt doesnt suit with movie.

only frustrating part for me is when people review rajas bgm they simply write one or few liners saying doesnt suit the film (i dont take those personally as if i dont like their reviews it just different perception which i agree everyone has their opinion). But there are fair amount of good portions as well or equally fair why not just say that as well. thats where it makes me feel something is missing in review itself. 

As far as kutramae thandanai is concerned those unique bird sounds (if not some would call over emphasized bird sounds not needed to show how standing in a balcony feels) i did like those sounds only when i fully completed the movie. when i was watching the movie i was wondering why bird sounds were frequently presented. it is more about giving subtle clues or hints (which i liked it atleast my own interpretation but that is where others might say it spoils the experience), Also there are several places where how camera pans the bgm goes alongs contracting or expanding. Why not mention good things as well instead of just shutting of making generic statement doesnt suit the movie? All the other tiny pieces goes in drain as if only guitar and violins are the only ones heard in the movie. Thats where i felt something is missing in review for bgm. Nothing personal.

Also i think for OAK myskin created the trailer with symphony of western artist and i think he has mentioned that to raja that he needs a score like that. he has already planted seeds how he wants a score for that movie. the trailer of OAK will carry piece not done by raja which i read somewhere. Forgot to mention while watching kutramae thandanai i did recollect few nandalala pieces where myskin and kids walk on the road. (for me those pieces which head before but doesnt mesh with film. thats how it makes me think may be just because it head this already somewhere ) so when several violin pieces keeps coming it gives a feel of monotonous hence bgm simply standing out of movie, even though we feel symphathy for characters it feels over emphasized. but those are not only the bgm portions there are other scenes where no violins or guitar but some unknown sounds are used which simply elevates the movie ( manikandan himself mentions in interview raja has used different sounds ) watching experience for sure and there are lots of it which try to give subtle clues hints about what is happening without spoiling the scene. there are left over impacts of nandala and OAK in kutramae thandanai. I am still not sure if people who write doesnt suit the movie are mentioning only those pieces. It will be helpful to know their views if they say which ones dont fit. then they might say i am not here to write review for bgm 

Balumahendra has mentioned raja knows when to use silence in his movies. 

Also sometimes when a novel is taken as movie people comment novel was way better and gives better imagination why take movie and spoil the novel. and some say movie was presented better than novel. I think people see similar kind of views for bgm when they watch a movie.

anyways end of my ranting after watching kutramae thandanai. hope think music releases a full bgm score (not just violin and guitar pieces)

web duniya

கதாப்பாத்திரங்கள் தேர்வில் 100 மதிப்பெண் பெற்றுள்ளார் மணிகண்டன். படத்தின் மிகப்பெரிய பலமாக இருப்பது ஒளிப்பதிவும், பின்னணி இசையும். இயக்குனர் மணிகண்டனே இந்த படத்தில் ஒளிப்பதிவும் செய்திருக்கிறார். ஒவ்வொரு காட்சியையும் செதுக்கியிருக்கிறார். இளையராஜா வெரைட்டியான பின்னணி இசையில் மிரள வைத்திருக்கிறார்.

http://cinema.nakkheeran.in/Talkies.aspx?T=3787
While "nakkeeran" is not to be taken as a serious movie reviewing place, this comment in their website could possibly indicate the perception of some segment of the public :

படத்தில் இசை இருந்ததா என்ற கேள்வியே வரலாம்? அது தான் இசைஞானி இளையராஜா! கதையோடு கதையாய் தன் ஆர்மோனியத்தின் ஜீவனை காட்சிகளில் கலந்துவிட்டார். கண்களை மூடிக்கேட்டாலும் காட்சிகள் புரியும் அளவிற்கு அவர் இசை மெய்மறக்க வைக்கிறது. இசை என்பது இதான் என இன்றைய, நாளைய இசையமைப்பாளர்களுக்கு இளையராஜாவின் பாடம் இப்படம்! 

vikatan's political comment on music of KT

படத்தின் இரண்டு ப்ளஸ் இசையும், ஒளிப்பதிவும். பாடல்கள் இல்லை. டைட்டில் கார்டில் ஆரம்பித்து, ஒவ்வொரு காட்சியிலும் வெரைட்டியான பின்னணி இசையில் படத்துடன் நம்மை இணைக்கிறார் இளையராஜா. க்ரைம் சீன், விதார்த்தின் எண்ணங்கள் அலைபாய்வது, ரகுமானின் குழப்பங்கள் என்று ஒவ்வொன்றையும் இசையில் கடத்துகிறார். அவரது பெஸ்ட் இல்லையென்றாலும், படத்தின் பெரிய பலமாய் இசை இருக்கிறது.

They possibly picked this line from director's interview to News Today

KT's BGM is perhaps getting as varied comments as some Kamal movies

See this comment by a blogger who claims himself to be someone who went specifically with "bgm-focus":
http://www.giriblog.com/2016/09/kutrame-thandanai-movie-review.html

படத்தில் பாடல்களே இல்லை. முழுக்க இளையராஜா பின்னணி இசை தான்.

இது போலப் பாடல்களே இல்லாமல் அல்லது மான்டேஜ் பாடல்கள் முயற்சியுடன் இனி திரைப்படங்கள் வர வேண்டும், நம்முடைய தமிழ் திரைப்படங்களின் தரத்தை மேலும் உயர்த்த வேண்டும் என்று விரும்புகிறேன்.

பின்னணி இசையின் ரசிகன் நான். எனவே, இதற்காக மற்றும் மணிகண்டன் இயல்பான இயக்கத்தைக் காண வேண்டும் என்பதற்காகவே சென்றேன்.

அனைவரும் புகழ்வது போல இளையராஜா பின்னணி இசை என்னை அவ்வளவாகக் கவரவில்லை. படமே சில நேரங்களில் டாக்குமெண்டரி படம் போலச் செல்கிறது. அதை இசை இன்னும் அதிகப்படுத்துகிறது.

பின்னணி இசை பழைய முறையில் உள்ளது. இன்னும் பயத்தையும் பரபரப்பையும் கூட்டியிருக்கலாம் ஆனால், சாதாரணமாகவே எனக்குச் சென்றது. டைட்டில் மற்றும் குறிப்பிட்ட சில இசை மட்டுமே என்னைக் கவர்ந்தது.

அனைவரும் பின்னணி இசையைப் புகழ்ந்து இருக்கிறார்கள். இதனால் எனக்கே என் மீது சந்தேகம் ஆகி விட்டது. என்னுடைய ரசனை சரியில்லையா?! என்று. Opinion differs!

Of course, it is his opinion - but the part to be noted is this : "இன்னும் பயத்தையும் பரபரப்பையும் கூட்டியிருக்கலாம் ஆனால், சாதாரணமாகவே எனக்குச் சென்றது." 

Means, depending upon the viewer's / listener's expectations, it was either "too dramatic" "ordinary and not dramatic" "romantic" "special" "overkill" "variety" "not IR's best"...

At the minimum, IR had pushed most TF viewers (and reviewers of course) to be "paying attention" to BGM

Look at this comment :
http://www.cineulagam.com/tamil/reviews-tamil/films/100699/

இளையராஜாவின் பின்னணி இசை, எந்த இடத்தில் இசை வேண்டும், எங்கு வேண்டாம் என்று உணர்ந்து செய்துக்கொடுத்துள்ளார்.

One more :
http://www.malartharu.org/2016/09/kutrame-thandanai.html

நாயகனுக்கு tunnel vision என்பதை எடுத்தஎடுப்பிலேயே வெளிப்படுத்தி நம்மைப் பரபரப்பிற்குள் ஆழ்த்திவிடுகிறார். அவனே முக்காலே அரைக்காலே மாகாணிக் குருடு. அவனிடம் வந்து, “அண்ணா, ரோடு கிராஸ்பண்ணி விடுறீங்களாண்ணா?” என்று ஒரு குருட்டுப்பெண் வேண்டுவதும் இளையராஜா பின்னிசையில் இளகுவதும், ஆஹா!
...
...
“ரஷோமோன்” படத்தின் கடைசிக்காட்சியில் அந்தத் துறவி, இன்னும் இந்த உலகில் மனிதாபிமானம் இருக்கிறது என்று காண்பித்ததற்காக விறகுவெட்டிக்கு நன்றிசொல்வார் இல்லையா? அப்படி இன்னும் தமிழ்நாட்டில் அறிவிருக்கிறது என்று நம்பியதற்காக மணிகண்டனுக்கு மீண்டும் நன்றி!

irfan123 wrote:
crimson.. as far as OAK bgm not meshing with film it is only few parts i thought like that for that crying scene and few places where characters were walking in dark streets . but those long horns and fast paced bgm for metro station scene and thrilling scenes in subway tunnel train the violins and trumphets and drums play and travel along with those scenes..starting from him opening the glass door, running on steps, pausing turning, finally stopping when those hollow trumphets blow as if train is approaching.. .also there are other pieces for bad guys and climax scene with other instruments comes into play. raja simply elevates what is being presented front of us.(again that is just me and others might feel such bgm not necessary)

Ok, suppose we say only few but it's still one scene too many.  In a pivotal scene like the one where the wolf sorrowfully narrates his tale, the music was a turn off for me as much as I loved listening to the same track on the BGM CD that had been released.  The point is, there can be problems with this kind of expressive BGM when the film itself strikes a different tone.  How problematic or not at all is dependent on each one's tastes but we must at least allow room for difference of opinion.  It's not a blot on IR in any case; he has done more than enough at this point and nobody doubts his capabilities esp in re-recording.  This doesn't mean every film needs an IR score.  

I do agree that it was indeed Mysskin who went and asked for that kind of score from IR, a decision that I still find baffling.  I can only conclude that, as I mentioned earlier, these guys go fanboy and start dreaming about what their film would look/sound like with a lavish IR spread.  But if you want THAT, you should make a different film.  Otherwise stick to your vision.

Deccan Chronicle

On the technical front Ilayaraja’s music sans songs is a big plus to the movie and Manikandan has taken the onus of cinematography, which he does it with aplomb.

indhu paper / Baradwaj Rangan

It’s wonderful to have Ilayaraja writing for the guitar again, and these understated passages beautifully capture the ebb and flow of Ravi’s inner world.

plum is making some excellent tweets on this "IR writing for guitar again" 

The next movie releasing in a month:
http://www.telugucinema.com/news/Abhishek-Pictures-bets-high-Manavoori-Ramayanam

On OAK. I strongly feel the score was too good for the movie. If only the film had better performances, it would have synced better.

Navin Mozart's 2 important posts on two of the film's tracks.

On Firefly:

https://t.co/OZvKSx2JxM

On Walking Between Life and Death:

https://t.co/vhowpt3kZu

The conceptualization (credits to Mysskin too) and execution is clearly beyond what even Mysskin has pulled off visually. Hence, the score feels strong.

Like a friend here notes: https://twitter.com/Kid_Glove/status/772720243500351488:

"As good as music as accessory point, one has to accept the influence of a Raaja/Morricone over mortals. The extent to which they take it fwd"


இவ்வளவு தாம்பா.

indhu paper Thamizh version

திரைக்கதையின் ஒலிப் பரிமாணமாக அமைந்திருக்கிறது இளையராஜாவின் இசை. பின்னணி இசையின் ஓசை தூக்க லாக அமைந்திருப்பது சில இடங்களில் உறுத்துகிறது. என்றாலும், உணர்வுகளை இசையாக மொழிபெயர்க்கும் இளைய ராஜாவின் படைப்பாற்றல் படத்தின் மதிப்பைக் கூட்டுகிறது.

"ஓசை தூக்கல்"  - sound engineer / director management, correct? (Sometimes even theater fellows' management  )

Probably they didn't want to contradict with their englees reviewer...

dinamani

I've seen some tweets referring to a FB post directed against this reviewer (soonAkAnA) but after seeing this page don't understand what was that for

இந்தாளு தான் ராசா பத்தி ஒன்னுமே எழுதலையே - நல்லது தானே? 

எரிச்சலைக் கெளப்புற மாதிரி ஏதாச்சும் எழுதாம இருக்கறது நல்லது தானே? 

"தினமணி பேப்பர்ல பின்னணி இசை பத்தி ஒன்னுமே சொல்லலை" என்பதெல்லாம் ஒரு பிரச்னையா என்ன?

This one is really funny - someone gives IR "concession"

http://www.truetamilan.com/2016/09/blog-post_5.html

டைட்டிலில் இருந்து கடைசிவரையிலும் பின்னணி இசை தேவைப்படும் நேரத்தில் இருக்கிறது. தேவையில்லாத இடங்களில் மெளனித்து காட்சிகள் செல்ல வழி விட்டிருக்கிறது. இசைஞானியின் இசையமைப்பை எந்தவிதத்திலும் குறை சொல்ல முடியாது. படத்தின் அழுத்தமான வெற்றிக்கு அவரும் ஒரு காரணமாக இருக்கிறார்.

app engine wow..that was a good summary of all reviews..
i go to theatre to watch "bgm-focused" (same as one reviewer said). thats the key.
i am always curious when watching movie how raja does the bgm for the scenes.

cutting pasting from your summary..this is exactly how i felt while watching KT.

இளையராஜா வெரைட்டியான பின்னணி இசையில் மிரள வைத்திருக்கிறார்.
key point..."variety" which is missing in most reviews. i am not sure still why even negative reviews fail
to catch this point. Again guitars and violins are not only the instruments in KT. sometime while watching
the KT i even doubted did raja got inspired by dark movies for bgm (those dark themes like nooravathu naal satyaraj first movie)
and so many places due to "varied sounds"
Those nandala/OAK violins however tone it differently (i think negative reviews might be implying this is
where bgm doesnt fit ..just another opinion..however if someone deeply analyses like druken monk pointed
out those violins will have a totally different meaning which a normal viewer like me may not interpret
but simply think why violins here and think i feel monotonous as i heard it before in another movie)

அவரது பெஸ்ட் இல்லையென்றாலும், படத்தின் பெரிய பலமாய் இசை இருக்கிறது.
may be should be read as it is not a mega composition like tharai thappatai or pazhasiraja but yet raja shows how bgm should be made

அனைவரும் புகழ்வது போல இளையராஜா பின்னணி இசை என்னை அவ்வளவாகக் கவரவில்லை.
படமே சில நேரங்களில் டாக்குமெண்டரி படம் போலச் செல்கிறது. அதை இசை இன்னும் அதிகப்படுத்துகிறது.
பின்னணி இசை பழைய முறையில் உள்ளது

if sad characters are walking on road or they worry about uncertain times typical violin plays
i think this might be the scenes and associated bgm people complain it is like tv serial etc

இன்னும் பயத்தையும் பரபரப்பையும் கூட்டியிருக்கலாம் ஆனால், சாதாரணமாகவே எனக்குச் சென்றது. டைட்டில் மற்றும் குறிப்பிட்ட சில இசை மட்டுமே என்னைக் கவர்ந்தது.

Innum..this means reviewer acknowledges bgm does elevate but wants it to be more elevated
title..again that dark theme looks like interested most people
kuripita sila isai..those unknown unique sounds including bird sounds

பின்னணி இசையின் ஓசை தூக்க லாக அமைந்திருப்பது சில இடங்களில் உறுத்துகிறது
Sila idangalil..yes again is it about those violins during sad portrayals ?
can we take this as otherwise other sounds are something unique ..

Manikandan mentioned in interview (posted by app engine) that raja noticed him and asked do you want that previous tune instead of this new one?
and simply put back the previous tune looking at him ..so which tune was that we dont know..

Frankly only thing to me like other negative reviews didnt jell with movie (some expert may deeply analyse and say why those violins are important)
or i felt like monotonous heard somewhere like nandala are those violins.
Apart from those there is something refreshing bgm in this movie.

crimson..i totally agree with you for this..
"In a pivotal scene like the one where the wolf sorrowfully narrates his tale, the music was a turn off for me as much as I loved listening to the same track on the BGM CD that had been released"...but we never know what is the reason for this ..two things..it is not just the violins but isnt that bgm was so loud? so cannot hear what myskin was saying..now if thats the case same as app engine mentioned "sound design" "sound engineer" ?? with pathos tune intact should the decibels to be low keeping vocals loud and instrument to play low ? then not sure if we would like that portion..i am not sure

another crying scene from mahanadhi..is it "veenai" being played in pathos mode ? and how about the decibels ..are the vocals can be heard clearly if kamal even has dialogues in the scene or just crying..to me myskin crying has crucial scene for the movie and kamal scene in mahanadhi is bit different but notice the decibels of instrument in bgm (please use headphone)...i think that is how raja keeps the level of bgm for pathos..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSMuVPh_cXw

https://youtu.be/8tFhpUU3ehE?t=341

i still remember when i watched mahanadhi in theatre i felt veenai kind of instrument played loudly (almost vennai was literally "crying" as well along with kamal in the scene)

I am not sure if someone reviews this scene now and say bgm was too loud or over dramatic (another opinion)
I would totally disagree when someone says that.

I dont have clip link but not sure how bgm was for the climax scene in moondram pirai..possibly only engine or train noise and kamal screaming