IR's waltz hits

Vizhiyile malarndhadhu follows the waltz pattern for sure,atleast the pallavi.

You can do a perfect waltz dance to the first interlude of paruvame pudhiya paadal. Naan pesa vandhen could be IR's first waltz in TFM, esp. the prelude and pallavi portions?

"paruvamE" is a good find, counterpoint
(I didn't think about it before)

Looks like the collection of IR-brand waltz will be as illustrious as any other SPECIAL IR-collection

#Opinion 5
When the movie director says "Our last project (& possibly songs too) didn't do well and I must have a hit song this time", the MD chooses to have "sure-fire-waltz-hit" and IR is no exception

Please recall my earlier opinions about waltz being easy listening for public and hence standing a better chance to be liked on first-listen and thus increasing its probability of becoming a hit   So, it's often a choice of MD under pressure to have a "hit song" (as in moongil thOttam of kadal or that very basic waltz number by Imman in the movie jeevA).

Initial IR-KBR projects didn't do as big as the GA-KBR film mouna geethangaL. Though indRu pOy nALai vA & vidiyum varai kAththiru were possibly money earners and definitely not flops, they didn't reach the scale of oru kai Osai or mouna geethangaL commercially (or from the public perspective). Also, while there were a few nice songs (that are listened to by TFM lovers even today), the albums weren't considered at par with other IR hit albums of that time period - that occupied all prime slots of the society (be it radio, vishEshams, teekkadais or buses).

So, IR-KBR combo was POSSIBLY under some kind of pressure to give a "super-hit" album, matching or surpassing hit albums of that time period (at least matching mouna geethangaL).

Among other "hit-formula" choices that IR had at that point of time, he did include a "waltz"

bhoopALam isaikkum can boast of EVERY OTHER characteristic that we've discussed in this thread (superb melody, terrific otherwise orchestration etc) and went on to become a big hit song. Also evergreen! (Of course, all the songs in that album were big hits, En sOga kadhaiyakkELu thAykkulamE topping among them and the movie was a commercial biggie as well).

To listen to good quality audio, go here : 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RX7AxOPGtOM

For the AV experience, please visit:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0mjFqtI2QU

Well, looks like IR should get back to using  waltz more often then. The collection here is amazing. Because I am trying to think of examples from the last 15 yrs and nothing jumps out, as much as his songs from the early yrs.


Nalam vaazha is another surprising revelation as a slow-tempo'ed waltz.

Counterpoint,

Here is one from recent years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTMWFxJI6Kg

Raaga_Suresh wrote:Counterpoint,

Here is one from recent years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTMWFxJI6Kg

That's interesting

Earlier I quoted another song from this album (swapnangaL kaNNezhudhiya) being of IR-waltz genre

With kaiyeththA and these two (and I don't know how many more we'll uncover), we can comfortably say Sathyan Anthikkad loves "waltz"

More proof in that Shyam composed song, one of my all-time-fav Malayalam songs for a Sathyan Anthikkad movie, the famous nAdOdikkAtRu

vaishAka sandhyE - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xu1cpEokGjA , a classic waltz
(Now I know why I am never tired of repeating this song  )

Thai maavin thanalil

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJlPXiLndCw

Orae naal unai naan nilavil parthadhu............

app,

idhu varai naan sonna paatu ellam thappa sariya nu sollunga.......

ayiram malargalae malarungal - Niram maradha pookal

Usha wrote:app,

idhu varai naan sonna paatu ellam  thappa sariya nu sollunga.......

ராகம் / தாளம் / லயம் பற்றியெல்லாம் எனக்கு அறிவு குறைவு, சுரேஷ்ஜி / வி எஸ்ஜி போன்றோர் தான் சொல்ல வேண்டும்

விக்கியின் வால்ட்ஸ் குறித்த பதிவின் அடிப்படையில் நான் சில பாடல்களை "pattern-matching" செய்து வால்ட்ஸ் என்று இங்கே பதித்துக் கொண்டிருக்கிறேனே ஒழிய அடிப்படை அறிவெல்லாம் கிடையாது

I feel "ore idam nirandharam .." from "sattam en kaiyil" can also qualify to get added to the  list. The song has Kamal and Sripriya doing waltz movements .

Oh butterfly butterfly.... solliyacha indha paatai........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcOC5L_KPfI


Day by day  from Honest Raj

http://tamilthiraipaadal.com/index.php?action=album&id=391&aname=Honest%20Raj

kakka kakka from Jule Ganapathy.. Starting portion.....

http://tamilthiraipaadal.com/index.php?action=album&id=205&aname=Julie%20Ganapathi

The next is going to be even more outrageous opinion

#Opinion 6 : Waltz is a favorite of IR himself (and his predecessor, MSV)



Of course, IR might dismiss telling that all music is 7 notes and nothing but wind etc. However, certain patterns give more enjoyment to us than others and which is why some songs are liked universally, become hits etc. Thus such patterns are often deployed by composers / musicians as well for the benefit (enjoyment) of the public!

That way, the fact that MSV told "sound of music" is his fav film pushes me to imagine that he did like the "my favorite things" song, the famous waltz number. (And extend my theory that MSV thought waltz is something special People who specialize on dissecting MSV music might find actual proof among his numbers ; I'm not one and hence won't dwell more on him).

Coming to IR, he definitely liked the "favorite things" number and one can even say his 'poottukkaL pOttAlum' of Kshatriyan is an inspiration of that

However, that's not the only reason for my opinion that Waltz is a fav of IR.

IR made two famous instrumental albums in 80's (HTNI & NBW) that had none of the requirements of film field / necessity to make them "hit songs" etc. That way, those show cased what really thrilled the composer and what he personally wanted to do for his own interest (than simply for the pull of movie industry).

In the first album, HTNI, he did almost all tracks predominantly with violin playing the lead melody - with the exception of one special last track, "Do anything". This had flute as the leader and folk (IMO) as the main format, rather than ICM or WCM as in other tracks, though they did a support role.

In many ways, I consider DO ANYTHING as the most special of the HTNI album and, voila, that is a WALTZ!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWPO0J2NWGw


I was so thrilled to hear this piece this AM on raajafm.com

What is more, IR followed up with the NBW album and it had 5 tracks.  They did play Composer's breath of NBW too on raajafm.com today and it has a sweet waltz portion!  
(I've posted about the track on official radio thread and please check the portion starting from about 3:45 of the youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4g6Zl4nB_g - very sweet waltz portion with some keyboard accompaniment)

That IR chose to have waltz in HTNI & NBW is more than proof that he loved it (if you don't buy the poottukkal pOttAlum inspiration thingy)

I think anybody who is not what we used to call "tr00 metalhead" would like a waltz or more generally 3/4 and 6/8.  But whether he has a particular affection for it is difficult to say since he has composed so many great tracks in 4/4 as any other great composer.  A composer needs to be able to be inventive with 4/4 before other things; it's the most ubiquitous.

CK,


BTW, I used to wonder if Chandramohan, who wrote the 'kAtRil kalandha isai' in The Hindu Thamizh version, had ever visited the hub or our forum.
(Well, our friend @drunkenmunk may be able to talk to him and find out but it's always interesting to "make a guess" on such questions  )

His most recent article (which happens to be the last one in that series, on the famous 1980 album Johny) briefly mentions about "waltz"

Waltz being among the recent and current threads in our forum, I wonder if he happens to read these posts and hence chose to mention that feature of 'en vAnilE orE veNNilA' in his article

Whether or not, that song is yet another one from a Mahendran movie (like paruvamE pudhiya pAdal pAdu and got released in the same year)...makes one wonder if Mahendran, like Sathyan Anthikkad, is a waltz lover...

In any case, I had earlier planned another of my "opinions" using en vAnilE...now that it had already got mentioned in the Hindu article, I need to bring a few more references to that opinion, to make it "richer"

Another relatively rare(not for some of us I guess) song from a lesser known but good Mike Mohan soundtrack
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XbL_YotTI0

Pon vaanile by SPB,PS. Love this bass guitarish waltz

counterpoint wrote:Another relatively rare(not for some of us I guess) song from a lesser known but good Mike Mohan soundtrack
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XbL_YotTI0

Pon vaanile by SPB,PS. Love this bass guitarish waltz

counterpoint,
Thank you for unearthing a rare beauty
Very imaginative , lush interludes that can transport anybody to the celestial land.

Nila kayum neram saranam

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3RXHC6AjUg


ondrodu ondranom anbalae

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5RAGaWonDM

Sandhana katre  sendthamizh ootrae


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mK7BUnXkN-c

#Opinion 7

This will have two parts (A & B) and it's quite easy to find exceptions to the part B (which I'll do in another post ). This was the thing I was planning to use for Johny song but I've got too many similar samples that it's no big deal that The Hindu made use of it earlier

Part A : IR chose to have AT LEAST ONE waltz number whenever he had an album of 5 songs or more. This is regardless of whether the album was a super hit one or happened to be for an unknown (worse, never released) movie! (I think this can be verified to be 99% correct easily and hence need not be even an opinion but just a statistical fact)

Part B : (This is definitely subjective and I myself plan to post exceptions soon) : While the Waltz number may not be the most innovative or most experimental song of the album in such 5 or more cases, it happened to be the most popular song either at the time of arrival or many years later

For part A, many songs posted so far happened to be from albums of 5 songs or more and should serve as samples. However, I need to give some fresh ones for this post - actually there are just too many albums with 5 or more songs with at least one waltz and I could end up listing too many. Just some random picks to prove this theory across time periods and across hit-not-hit variations...

- The song that ends the phenomenally successful mundhanai mudichchu movie was the simple waltz number "nAn pudikkum mAppiLLai dhAn, nAdaRinja mannavan dhAn"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a32iD22MeHM


- The fantastic dharbAri kAnada plus IR-Waltz combo that is one of the bestest ever in TFM - Isai mEdaiyil indha vELaiyil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQOpoPLqbZ8


-  The sweet paRandhAlum vida mAttEn in Guru (this album has more than one, I think 'nAn vaNangukiRen' too can be included in this thread)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5aPFuYJqGA


As I said, just too many - please pick any album with 5 or more and you'll hit one. Not just super hit ones as above, even unreleased ones like 'nAdi thudikkudhadi' has the sweet 'veli nAttu grAmappuRaththil' sweet IR waltz.  Or the most recent 'AttakkAri mAman poNNu' of 1000th film that had 500k+ hits on youtube even without any video!

Now, for part B, I want to specify two beautiful samples. These songs are perhaps not the "most innovative" or "most experimental" in those phenomenal albums. However, they've earned the "most popular" appeal and are maintaining that status even after decades

mounamAna nEram of salangai oli  - I don't think this can take the 'innovation' or 'experimentation' prize in that album - with all those terrific classicals and innovations such as thakida thidhimi or vAn pOlE. However, to this date, this is the one more popular than others IMHO.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdQuri8F8vs


Likewise, kaNmaniyE pEsu from kAkki chattai. This album has phenomenal pattukkannan (is that waltz also?),  pooppOtta dhAvaNi & vAnilE thEnilA - all more innovative or experimental stuff. However, on radio or otherwise, this song took the first prize and is popular to this day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWeNIntlmvI

Vaa Vaa Vasanthame is a fantastic waltz that way. Youngster Gopal Shyamantak explores it. Read the description (first comment) as you listen:



Same way, petromax light e vendaam naa, Violin Vicky has a demo where he explores IR's Jazz Waltz and how Dil Dil Dil Dil Manadhil and a couple of other songs (one a rare Gaanam Than Kaatrodu; a favorite since I discovered it through Vicky) fit the bill:

Drunkenmunk wrote:Vaa Vaa Vasanthame is a fantastic waltz that way. Youngster Gopal Shyamantak explores it. Read the description (first comment) as you listen:

WOW, excellent post (and cover as well). mikka nanRi, for the link!

Same way, petromax light e vendaam naa, Violin Vicky has a demo where he explores IR's Jazz Waltz and how Dil Dil Dil Dil Manadhil and a couple of other songs (one a rare Gaanam Than Kaatrodu; a favorite since I discovered it through Vicky) fit the bill:

Yes, this was the video (and the blog post by him) that kind of opened my ears to the "IR-Waltz" genre
(Of course, I linked his article in the opening post of this thread )

I tried to apply my opinion 7(a) for some of the popular albums that had >= 5 songs...voila! The theory does prove to be correct

payaNanagaL mudivadhillai - the sweet 'sAlaiyOram sOlai onRu'
(Actually someone has mentioned that the TT song AttakkAri mAman poNNu has a connection to sAlaiyOram based on the "din-ta, din-ta, din-ta, din-ta" sound As we can see, there's also this IR-Waltz connection)

iLamai oonjalAdukiRadhu - orE nAL unai nAn nilAvil pArththadhu (this song also proves my theory 7b )

thaLabathi - chinnaththAyavaL (there's another song, mArgazhi dhAn OdippOchchu which also follows waltz)

agni natchaththiram - that gorgeous 'oru poongAvanam' (this is proof for 7b also)

Please feel free to pick any such album and try to identify the IR-Waltz in it (I can assure you that it's a sweet exercise!)

Usha wrote:

kakka kakka from Jule Ganapathy.. Starting portion.....

http://tamilthiraipaadal.com/index.php?action=album&id=205&aname=Julie%20Ganapathi

This JG album has two terrific IR-Waltz numbers

KJY's 'minmini pArvaiga'L (quite straight forward waltz, easily mapped to the pattern in Vicky's video)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYQLJ6stRJc

And the sweet SG number 'enakkup pidiththa pAdal' also:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLPLOI6KpGE


I think both these songs got referred when people commented on the lovely 'kanulu kalanu' of abbAyithO ammAyil

While posting opinion 7b, I said there are exceptions and I'll be posting some.

Here are two of them

The first one is from the famous album 'pagalil oru iravu'.

I was thoroughly impressed the first time I heard that song on radio when it arrived. Said to myself - "hA, I've never heard a movie song like this before!" The lovely SJ number was so novel for the time of arrival - if that was not innovative / experimental, then what was?

thAmtha dheemtha Adum uLLam pAdum kAviyam, a beautiful IR-Waltz from his early days i.e. late 70's!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6w6zldNhWic


BTW, while this song was the most innovative and experimental song of that album (IMHO), it was not the most popular one (then or now). If I say this song was a waltz and thus became more popular than "iLamai enum poongAtRu", that would be ludicrous That way, this song happened to be a big exception on both the counts (most innovative of the album but less popular than a "thaka-dhimi-thaka-junu" 4 beat song!)

Interestingly, when I was trying to get the youtube of this song, the results included a beautiful Vicky cover:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whEXzhKvv3U


More interesting are these comments by him for the youtube:

Not many people have looked beyond "Ilamai enum Poongatru" from the movie "Pagalil Oru Iravu". There is an unbelievable Mohanam in that movie and that is this week's pick.

From the very first listening, the song "Thaamtha theemtha" has intrigued me.. Everything about the song - Its Rhythm and its jumbled usage of Mohanam, abundant usage of 12th notes in a rather classical song etc., is unique and there is no other song till date from the Maestro with all these properties. If I have the authority, I would prescribe this song along with "Geetham Sangeetham" for the class of 'Thaatu varisai' in Carnatic music learning.

Apart from this, the hero(ine) of the song is of course S Janaki. If you are an aspiring (or even professional) singer out there, you should try this song and emulate her clean execution at the same pitch (F) ... It would do you a world of good and that's the same reason why I attempted it in Piano though its far from perfect :-)

And a while ago, I wrote an article on Ilaiyaraaja's jazz waltz. I deliberately didn't talk about this song in that article, because this is biggest of them all and one of the early works of Raaja. So I wanted to give this song its due focus at a later time.

On waltz, he practically wrote the words that were exactly in my mind

The second number is quite innovative and experimental too - but I cannot say it was the most innovative in that album

That's because the album happens to be nizhalgaL  EACH AND EVERY NUMBER THERE IS A PHENOMENON and one cannot single out one song for musical speciality

However, I call this the "exception" because this was the LEAST POPULAR number from the album (and also didn't appear on screen).

i.e. despite having elements of "IR-Waltz"

dhooraththil nAn kaNda un mugam
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZxNprirvzI

(I don't think the visuals are for that song, though they are from the movie)

The song found its way into sitArA of Telugu, however! And here are some original visuals for this special melody/ IR-Waltz :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yiYUP7t-uw

Ninaivo oru paravai  -  Sigappu Rojjakal

Kadhal nilave from Vasuki

http://www.saavn.com/s/song/tamil/Vasuki/Kaadhal-Nilavu/Fz9TdUFnYFY