Re: Onaayum Aattukkuttiyum (The wolf and the lamb) - Mysskin

fring151 Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:22 am

crimson king wrote:I think, contrary to what his acolytes say, Rangan is better at reviewing films, especially the bad ones where his sarcasm comes through, rather than music. This passage from his Krrish 3 review was just too much:

"The simplest dialogue, thus, comes off sounding like a florid aria. In an early scene (involving a Flair pen-cum prism), Rohit tells Krishna that his experiment needs the sun. It’s night, so they wait – and then, when the sun comes up, Krishna looks at the sky and says “Papa… suraj” with such tremulous awe that you think he was some kind of cave creature who has set eyes, for the first time, on this fiery orb in the heavens."

In music, he just seems to consume pop culture rather than appreciate it independent of the film.

Lol. That was truly imaginative - read the full review on his blog - must be one unwatchable movie. Ya, I like his snarky reviews. I think he does some politically correct ones and occasionally lets loose and vents with these snarky ones. Laughing

I remember committing the crime of watching 'Ayan' in the theatre in my college days. Loled like anything on reading this:

"IF THERE’S ONE THING YOU WON’T FIND in Ayan, it’s dead air. KV Anand’s unpretentious entertainer zips by like a rocket on steroids, propelled by a can’t-do-no-wrong Suriya dropped into a series of international smuggling scenarios that, at least on the Tamil screen, seem utterly new. What’s old, however, is the insistence on virtue. The hero stumbles into a den of flirty prostitutes, and to see him flap around like a flustered rooster, you’d think the worst fate that could befall a man who can single-handedly dispatch scores of villains is to have his privates groped. We’re still in an era where it isn’t just the heroine who needs to stay pure, but also the hero, who’s such an innocent, he appears unaware of the purpose of sanitary napkins. But to be fair, these scenes are played for laughs, and more importantly (and despite a doddering latter half), there’s little opportunity for these ruminations during the running time. That, really, is the success of Ayan."

crimson king Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:32 am

I think that - the MR Karthik death scene - is just an exploitation of unfortunate coincidence. And the problem is not that that these kind of things don't happen at all. Barely a month after her marriage, one of my aunts was riding pillion with her husband (who was, aptly, not wearing a helmet) and a van rammed into them. He died almost instantly in the crash. In a different case, the daughter of one of my mother's acquaintances eloped with her lover on the day of her engagement ceremony (with the 'official' groom). These kind of strange things do happen. The problem is the tendency of our filmmakers to over-exploit these and reduce them to cliches.

I somehow found the amateurish tone of the acting in OAK very appropriate. I think the whole problem is the way OAK got projected as a thriller. I see ravi nat sir also referring to it as a thriller. It is not. And this projection has cast expectations in a certain light (because we expect some measure of technical finesse in a thriller of all genres). Read the conversation between myself and DM and watch the film again, maybe with good print. It's much deeper than a typical thriller film and imo the thriller aspect is incidental. That makes me personally want to overlook the flaws because such films are not usually made in Kolly/Bolly and even in Holly, such 'grey' films are rare to come across. I also don't think it's a Raja film made by Mysskin at all. For all his fandom, Mysskin has actually given IR very little scope for experimenting in BGM compared to say Kaaki Chatthai or Nooravuthu Naal.

crimson king Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:37 am

That Ayyan review is still a bit more politically correct. He has tried to argue that it is at least engrossing. It was extremely headache inducing, that much I know. He just explained to me on the Krissh review comments that he generally tries to find whether there is some context in which the movie works. Fair enough, then....though I'd much rather reviewers cut slack for small films than these overrated, expensive masala bores singing the same notes again.

fring151 Mon Nov 04, 2013 8:55 am

crimson king wrote:I think that - the MR Karthik death scene - is just an exploitation of unfortunate coincidence. And the problem is not that that these kind of things don't happen at all.

True. I agree, but there is something about that particular scene which irks me , also probably because I have not heard anyone else complain about the bizarreness of the whole scenario. To dissect this a bit more, Karthik being killed outside the (court?) where Revathi is waiting for him is...ok....somewhat believable. Karthik being shot by a policeman in the same location in front of Revathi...Okkkk...shit happens. But Karthik getting killed by a random bullet fired as the cop accidentally pulls the trigger as he is falling from his jeep due to a random van colliding into his vehicle just as he has almost caught up with Karthik outside the court where Revathi is waiting for him...you get the point. That's shameless exploitation of coincidence and betrays a lack of imagination. Mouna rAgam works well in patches for me, but certain scenes and sequences are just too contrived and amateurish... also MR's now well documented epic fail at humour.

The MR movie I've enjoyed most so far has been AlaipAyuthey which was a well-made movie overall.

fring151 Mon Nov 04, 2013 9:00 am

crimson king wrote:I somehow found the amateurish tone of the acting in OAK very appropriate. I think the whole problem is the way OAK got projected as a thriller. I see ravi nat sir also referring to it as a thriller. It is not. And this projection has cast expectations in a certain light (because we expect some measure of technical finesse in a thriller of all genres). Read the conversation between myself and DM and watch the film again, maybe with good print. It's much deeper than a typical thriller film and imo the thriller aspect is incidental. That makes me personally want to overlook the flaws because such films are not usually made in Kolly/Bolly and even in Holly, such 'grey' films are rare to come across. I also don't think it's a Raja film made by Mysskin at all. For all his fandom, Mysskin has actually given IR very little scope for experimenting in BGM compared to say Kaaki Chatthai or Nooravuthu Naal.

I did watch the movie in a not-so-great print, so I might very well have missed a lot of things. Will catch the vijaytv print after it is (hopefully) up on youtube.

Re Ayan, that was the movie which made me decide not to watch a Tamil movie again unless it comes strongly recommended by folks whose judgement I trust. And ya, that wasn't Rangan's snarkiest, though he concedes it's engrossing in an obviously condescending way and the discerning reader wouldn't have missed the sarcastic undertone. Smile

crimson king Mon Nov 04, 2013 9:12 am

I mean that he generally does make concessions for masala films and I think he genuinely enjoys at least parts of them unless they are Krissh-bad. He still believes in the old masala-art divide and I am not sure how much he has recognized the way multiplexes have opened up space for middle-of-the-road films. This came out in his comparison of GVM working with IR to MR approaching MSV for Agni Natchathram (for which he got flak). The spread of multiplexes and also digital bringing out printing costs have allowed filmmakers like Bala, Thangarbacchan, Mysskin, Prakash Raj more space (all of whom have worked with IR). Likewise, Balki's films may not be hip but they are also not 'outdated' and he again worked with IR. This kind of thing may not have happened in the 80s where it was either commercial or parallel cinema but things are more complex now and there is more space for directors trying something different to survive. IR doesn't need to work with Thala Ajith or Ilayathalapathi anymore to remain in the business.

Drunkenmunk Mon Nov 04, 2013 9:25 am

Just pasting a couple of twitlongers from equanimus:

http://t.co/PEfcwmv0lG

http://t.co/Wn21kU2OhJ

Quite clearly, there is lot more to it than meets the eye. I myself need to view it another time. Vijatv's youtube account officially uploads all the films a few days after they telecast them in good quality.

crimson king Mon Nov 04, 2013 9:42 am

Very interesting tweets. This is my own entry on how OAK differs significantly from typical filmmaking styles in Tamil cinema, with no disrespect to those. The fact that a lot of the 'loaded' content is implied through non verbal cues is what makes this film both tricky and intriguing. If you miss the implications of non verbal cues - like the question the angel asks of the lamb without even saying a word, when she's shot - you miss the very gist of the film. Hats off to Mysskin for his guts, is all I can say.

http://rothrocks.wordpress.com/2013/11/03/onaayum-aatukuttiyum-and-the-classification-fix/

Onaayum Aatukuttiyum and the classification fix

Once, an inquisitive interviewer decided to probe me a little bit about my taste in books. What genres did I read, he wanted to know. I tried to give answers and found myself getting vague. Finally, just to settle the discussion, I agreed to “Drama”. But truthfully, I don’t know what genre the next book I enjoy reading would be from. I was reminded of the interview when I watched Onaayum Aatukuttiyum and considered the reviews.
It’s a thriller, but with a difference, it seems. It’s not a commercial movie, but still a bit mainstream, apparently. Mysskin is an auteur but a crude one. And so it goes. My question: does it matter? I understand the convenience of neatly classifying art into established categories. But what if it gets to the point that it paralyses the audience from accepting divergence from the norm?

Because Onaayum Aatukuttiyum does diverge from the norm, and at deeper levels than what classification captures. I associate Tamil culture with dialogue and plenty of it, often delivered at high pitch. I remember accompanying a cousin from the United States to the Mylapore Tank and she watched in amazement and amusement as two flower vendors quarreled loudly, reeling off words at some insane speed.

Consider then a film which uses limited dialogue. It is not however a silent film a la Pushpak. It just relies more on plenty of non verbal communication. An unspoken question on the face of a woman who has been shot, demanding to know why the boy couldn’t warn her and the boy looking on horrified as he realises he has helped take the life of a harmless person…that is, another lamb like him.

Moral dilemmas also distinguish the film from the run of the mill. Through psychological interplay evolving through actions, decisions, choices rather than dialogue, Mysskin gradually blurs the line between good and evil. It is often possible to see a world with a clearly etched out moral compass in mainstream action/thriller flicks…much like the stated worldview of George W Bush, perhaps. That is not the case in Onaayum Aatukuttiyum. With only a few but significant words, Mysskin depicts the lamb as being wrapped up in the same confusion that the audience finds itself in. He tells the police he doesn’t know if he can trust them anymore. He initially believes the ungrateful wolf has put him through much misery in return for his act of saving his life but he gradually realises there is no escape route.

The crux of it all is finally clear when the wolf lays the cards on the table in the longest single stretch of dialogue in the film. And here again, the resolution differs significantly from what we are offered and have come to expect in our films. The wolf does not appeal to morals. He does not attempt to justify his acts a la “Avana Nidutha Sollu, Naan Nidutharen”. There is no recrimination, no blame game, no tirades (more the better). Instead the wolf simply appeals to humanity. He makes us believe that the supposedly dangerous criminal and sharp shooter is really now a helpless victim of circumstance condemned to remain perpetually on the run to evade the people who would rather he resume the hunt than seek redemption for killing a lamb.

The last respect in which it differs is the role of Ilayaraja’s background score. Mysskin is possibly the greatest fan of Ilayaraja and certainly the most expressive of his admiration of the maestro’s music. However, when it comes to the film, he leaves little room for Ilayaraja to lay out his trademark motifs. Ilayaraja’s themes are, as usual, rich in emotion but the film appears to avoid elevating the emotions to larger than life proportions and searches instead for a silent intensity. I think it was director Kasturiraja who once said that if you hand over your film to Ilayaraja for re-recording, he will write his own script through the music and take the film to a place altogether different from what you imagined. But Mysskin constrains Ilayaraja with his focused vision and, for once, makes the background score subordinate to the overall requirements of the film. So much for the munanni isai styling, then. Here then is a film that is simply too good, too evolved to require a bail out from the maestro.

In toto, so many aspects where Onaayum Aatukuttiyum simply breaks free. It remains true to Mysskin’s vision and there is no apparent effort to compromise the narrative to meet Kollywood box office imperatives. There is no attempt either to make space for Ilayaraja’s genius (there are no songs either) It seems that in spite of this (and in spite of positioning the film as a thriller which is not quite what it is), the film has grossed over Rs.9 cr at the box office and made money for the producer (Mysskin himself). That in itself is a landmark event in Tamil cinema. Maybe the audience has trusted their intuitions a little more than critics and appreciated the film for what it is rather than what it does and does not fit into.

fring151 Mon Nov 04, 2013 10:29 am

Very interesting takes by CK and equanimus. I will definitely watch it again if/when vijaytv uploads it on youtube and comment on your review after that Smile

sagi Mon Nov 04, 2013 6:14 pm

I don't think the acting in Mysskin films (I have seen all) could be termed 'amateurish'. It is intentionally loud and animated like some of the Jap films (Read Kurosawa's). Most of his protaganists channel Toshiro Miffune. And that is why you see the acting so different from other mainstream Indian films.

crimson king Mon Nov 04, 2013 6:19 pm

Maybe it's that touch of rawness in the acting. This film, that is, I haven't seen any of his other films but say the way Mysskin himself enacted the monologue in the 'crux' scene, is kind of raw (actually I found it believable that way) and not necessarily sticking to dramatic conventions.

**V_S** Tue Nov 05, 2013 3:37 am

Great reviews Ravi and CK. I still need to grasp the film in its entirety, having watched just once. The music was revolving around me even after hours I watched the movie. I had lot of questions/doubts even regarding the story. I kind of even thought the questions posted by rozavasanth are very valid in the first link below, till I read the story in detail from writercsk's link, which also makes much sense. That cleared many of my doubts about the story and the questions I had in my mind. In any case, their views are not to be missed. These links are not for those who are yet to watch the film, as it reveals the entire story which would kill the suspense.

http://rozavasanth.blogspot.com/2013/10/blog-post.html
http://rozavasanth.blogspot.com/2013_10_01_archive.html (still need to read the refined version)

http://www.writercsk.com/2013/10/blog-post_14.html

**V_S** Tue Nov 05, 2013 4:10 am

Suresh ji,
Wonderful take on OAK music. the clap

I too concur with your views that this film cannot be just classified as a thriller (or having just one genre). Like Maestro's music which always has that multi-dimension, this film also has that nature. Very few films belong to this category. Scoring for this kind of movie is not that easy. Still I will have to watch again.

app_engine Wed Nov 13, 2013 10:24 pm

rozavasanth blog post on a facebook critic named Chakravarthy

ஓநாயும் ஆட்டுகுட்டியும் படத்தின் கதாபாத்திரங்கள் அதன் குணம் சார்ந்த தன்மைகளை கணக்கில் கொண்டு அதை தீம் இசையாக வெளிப்படுத்தி இளையராஜா அளித்திருப்பதை புரிந்து கொள்ளமல் சக்ஸ் உளறினார்( "there is no thematic design in the music...I mean something like a leitmotif "). ராஜாவின் இசை இவர் எட்டமுடியாத உயரத்தில் உள்ளது; ஒருமுறை படம் பார்த்து புரியாததில் நியாயம் உண்டு. ராஜன்குறை சாதரண தமிழில் எழுதியது கூடவா புரியவில்லை.

app_engine Thu Nov 14, 2013 6:51 pm

edhir(i)kkatchi using rozavasanth

மூவருக்கும் ‘மூக்கு’ புடைப்பாக இருக்கக்கூடும் என்பது என்னுடைய ஆகச்சிறந்த அவதானிப்பு. ஏன் சொல்கிறேன் என்றால் மூன்றுமே நல்ல கட்டுரைகள் என்றாலும் படித்ததும் சட்டென புரிந்துக்கொள்ள முடியாத அளவிற்கு ‘சொயட்டி சொயட்டி’ எழுதியிருக்கிறார்கள். யாருக்குமே புரியாம எழுதி அப்படி என்னடாப்பா சாதிக்க போறீங்க ? சுரேஷ் கண்ணன் நம்மாளு தான். முன்பெல்லாம் நல்லாத்தான் எழுதிக்கொண்டிருந்தார். யாரோ அவரை உயிர்மை, தயிர்மை’ன்னு செமயா ஏத்தி விட்டிருக்காங்க. இப்பல்லாம் மனிதர் புல்ஸ்டாப் வைக்காம ஒரே வாக்கியத்துல ஒரு நான்கு பக்க கட்டுரையை கட்டமைக்க முயன்றுக்கொண்டிருக்கிறார்.

app_engine Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:48 pm

budhdhA on OnAy

Smile

app_engine Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:43 am

Some southie top 10 list for the year

IBNLive wrote:
Onayum Aatukuttiyum: It's the most underrated Tamil film of the year from filmmaker Mysskin, who also featured in it with a bevy of newcomers. Fittingly titled 'Onayum Aatukuttiyum', which translates to 'The Wolf And The Lamb', it is a touching story about the redemption of an ex-assassin (wolf) on a mission to amend his past with the help of a medical student (lamb). Maestro Ilayaraja's background score breathed life into the masterpiece.

app_engine Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:37 pm

More BGM than what got released by Mysskin :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3naKqMhVKE

Navin Mozart vAzhga!

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