Re: India - Australia 2013 Test Series

Wizzy Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:01 am

V_S wrote:
plum wrote:Disastrous result for Indian Cricket. Valorises the cunning Dhoni-mAmA combine.
Details please.

Dhawan out, Raina in for Delhi Test

**V_S** Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:17 pm

I read Dhawan is injured and hence this decision. If you are questioning about Dhoni/Seenu maama's decision in inclusion of Suresh Raina, then it is a huge debatable topic which we need to go back decades of Indian Cricket history, if not World Cricket History. If you want to go that route, I can chip in my 2 cents.

As you might know, we (Tamilnadu players) have been deprived of their deserved places right from when cricket began in India. Just because Raina and Dhoni are playing for CSK, that do not automatically qualify to belong to TN. Same way how much VVS has to prove to stay in the team, while the likes of Ravi Shastris, Manoj Prabhakars, Agarkars and innumerable others who doesn't even know how to play cricket were granted their undeserving places for a long time (some were even captaining India which was the biggest joke). I can proudly say, I can play better cricket than them. I have so many examples like this. If Raina's inclusion is a bias (I am not favoring him since I say this), then its better we also look at our history is all I am saying. Now the wheel of fortune is in Maama's hands like how it was in others hands earlier.

Even then I still don't see Wasim Jaffer who is almost a icon in TN and still playing well. He is already 35 (I think), when will he get his another chance? If there is a bias, I would even say Sachin's selection is also a bias. I know he is a legend and does not have to prove anything at this stage, but does he really deserve to be in the team now for cricketing reasons or more for psychological reasons? Who has the guts to rest him based on his current performance. We go only by the past glory and sentiments. That's not wrong I say. In one way that is also a bias. No offense against him and I respect him, just that we are being too critical when it comes to Dhoni/Seenu maama while we try to keep silent when it comes to others. Then that is also a bias right?

Cricket was never a fair game outside of the stadium (that is even applicable to any team sport). Even on the ground, we started seeing its unfairness. For me, once that 11 are decided, how well they play on the ground and how fair they play and how they play together as a team is most important rather than behind the scenes dirty politics. Again I am not saying the selection is correct, it is happening everywhere. Imagine if Panesar bowled in the first test match against us. Why was he not selected in the first test match? If we dig deeper and deeper we won't get answers, only frustration remains. Let's enjoy the game on the ground and have fun! Smile

Wizzy Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:38 pm

V_S, I'm all for nepotism/revenge but at what cost? surely not to fill the coffers of Dhoni's philsopher/misguide Rhiti Arun Pandey. what has Suresh Raina got to do with TN cricket? if you want to play victim card for years of wrong doing least use the wheel of fortune to get Mukundan into the 11(direct swap for injured Dhawan and with good domestic record to boot) Raina with an season avg. of 33 shouldn't be anywhere near the test team. this is an classic case of shortchanging cricket watching public.

before this Oz series got started Sach was the only Indian cricketer other than Che to be in the ICC top 20 ranked test players surely he commands a place in the test team for some cricketing reason if not for psychological reasons and also 15,700 runs comes with some bias and what has Dhoni done in test cricket to even warrant a bias??

my gripe with Dhoni are as follows/

He has scant respect for test cricket, doesn't give a dime for any whitewashes we went/might go through.

if anything Dhoni just doesn't grasp test cricket which has been amply proved by his continued selection of odi specialists/chuddy buddies for tests. worse admonished Che for wanting to prove himself overseas.

can you name a single bowler who has flourished under his captaincy? if anything Harbhi who bowled attacking lines under Ganguly/Dravid/Kumble, has regressed into a defensive bowler under him.

crappiest unlucky phastt bowler ever to play 50 tests continues to play whilst Pankaj singh/Shammi et al continue to be in sidelines.
he hardly plays domestic cricket nor does he keep tabs on domestic cricketers other than those who play for CSK.

Dhoni (odi)instinct to save a boundary and to limit to single goes against the very fabric of test cricket which gets amplified when India go overseas and less said about his wkt keeping skills the better.

**V_S** Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:06 pm

wizzy,
I agree with your view point about Dhoni and his igorance to watch the domestic cricket to pick players. I don't know if we can blame only Dhoni for this. I know he is a horrible wk. To me he is the most successful Test/ODI/t20/CSK/CL captain I have ever seen and a great finisher of the game. Without him we could have never imagined another world cup which is enough for me. Even Sachin who was eyeing world cup right from Azharuddin days, but only Dhoni could give him that. If there are so much concerns on Dhoni's captaincy, can I ask another hypothetical question? Why Sachin could not do/continue captaincy? (I know he did for few) What's the reason? Since it spoils his cricketing skills and becomes over burden and he could not concentrate right?. He is relieved of the mighty task of captaining. You give all liberties to him, yet no responsibilities taken by him other than playing (that too occasionally nowadays). In case Sachin would have captained and failed in batting, we also give him the benefit that the captaincy burden spoiled him. If Sachin would have captained and lost a test match, again he gets a benefit that he didn't get a good team. I agree we do this out of passion and he is revered as a legend and genius, but are we true to ourselves? If we are looking for Raina's season average which is correct, why are we not looking for Sachin's test runs in 2012 of 274 with an average of 22.83 in 12 Test innings? His last century was in Jan 2011 against SA. If Raina's inclusion is a bias, I feel Sachin's retention nullifies that bias. Also Raina is a left-hander and a better fielder which might be under consideration.

But on the other hand what liberty Dhoni has got? Are we crediting Dhoni for anything at all? He has to bat consistently, he has to captain correctly, he has to pick the right team, he has to wk correctly, most of all he has to win/draw consistently. If he fails in any one, all blame to him. If he succeeds, all credit to the team. It is not like those days, where we had just tests and ODIs. Now we have too many cricket matches one after another. I could not imagine how Dhoni is even managing everything one after another. I admire his guts of taking all the responsibilities to himself which most feared to take it and winning it handsomely.

If you are looking answers for 8-0 whitewash, I will look for praising him for being the most successful test captain. If you attribute the team not just Dhoni for becoming a successful test captain, I will also attribute the same team for 8-0 loss, not just Dhoni. Similarly, I too have concerns on Sachin, Harby's current form, but to me Sachin is never a finisher and hardly (we can number out those innings) plays when it matters the most; ex. third/fourth innings of test matches (his average is very poor and the total number of runs he scored is not even 10% of what he scored in total); I'll never forget we losing to Pak in Chennai, having come so close. In ODIs, he falters when chasing a moderate to high scores most of the time. I am not nitpicking Sachin intentionally, if we are looking for positive sides, there are also negative sides and vice versa for every one. If there is so much of Dhoni bashing (I don't blame you), we should also look for the positive sides of cricket where he contributed and made India proud not just once or twice, several times, just like we do for many other cricketers. Definitely they are not just one or two to ignore. All I am saying is bias is everywhere, we have to live with it. If he satisfies you, he might not satisfy other. That's a part and parcel of every game. All I am asking for is vengala kiNNam for him. Smile

Wizzy Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:53 am

V_S little did I know Laughing

you have mixed up too many things, honestly have nothing to add after you had equated Sach to Raina and even questioned his effectiveness in tests, we can only hope Sach starts being a better fielder and better bat left handed to warrant a place in the side.

**V_S** Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:57 pm

I think I didn't make my point clear or you didn't get me. Whenever we talk of Sachin, we want to save and safe guard him at any cost (and no answers to my questions) and all my questions are nullified and bear no significance because of that, but we don't take that same liberty when analyzing others. Why is that double tendency? I am not equating Sachin to Raina/Dhoni, that is a sin I know, all I am asking is get the same scale of measurement for everyone (based on their current performance)', which is not only possible within us, even with Dhoni and the selection management. That's why as I said, if we analyse everyone's selection/performancej, there will none be left in the team. Anyway, lets leave this topic as we could not meet. Smile

Wizzy Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:42 pm

V_S, with India not playing @ home for foreseeable future, we can exchange notes on Dhoni's legacy after he quits tests when the losses starts denting his commercial interest (only hope)

Ojha makes a smart move cheers

ATG/Sehwag should bury the hatchet and join Rhiti sports

Another Indian cricket star, Pragyan Ojha has joined Rhiti Sports Management, the company that handles Mahendra Singh Dhoni amongst others.

Recently, Suresh Raina had also joined the talent management firm recently and this brings the total number of players/celebrities under the firm to six (Dhoni, Ravindra Jadeja, Suresh Raina, Pragyan Ojha, RP Singh and Saina Nehwal).

Pragyan Ojha has joined MS Dhoni and Suresh Raina on the Rhiti roster.

Founded in 2007 by Arun Pandey, who is Dhoni’s childhood friend, Rhiti Sports forayed into the world of sports marketing & celebrity management. And within a period of five years, they have made huge strides in the market.

Their philosophy, as proclaimed on their website, is simple: All management can be reduced to three words – people, product and profits. People come first.

Rhiti burst into the limelight in July 2010 when they announced that they have signed a Rs 200 crore three-year endorsement deal with Dhoni. It was the most expensive deal signed by a cricketer – beating Tendulkar’s three-year deal with sports management firm Iconix, signed in 2006, which was worth Rs 180 crore.

In September 2012, they also signed a 40-crore deal with Rhiti, making her the country’s highest paid sportsperson outside cricket.

http://www.firstpost.com/sports/ojha-joins-dhoni-raina-at-rhiti-sports-671365.html

2040 Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:27 pm

Vijay is also with Rhiti...

**V_S** Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:05 pm

To be honest, I don't even expect Dhoni (nor want) to be talked about in future, just that currently he impresses me so much, that none did recently. Again having said that, I kind of lost interest in cricket due to the void created by great players and the fairest/honest way they play cricket. I still visualize Gavaskar going off the field without even looking at the umpire when he nicks the ball. I still visualize Courtney Walsh warning the runner without taking the bails off. The temparament with which they play (especially test cricket) to save a test match. Those glorious days of cricket is already gone except few traces are there here and there. I hate the sledging, heated exchanges, showing middle finger, DRS, unnecessary appealing, two chances to review, these third umpires reviewing incorrectly, authorizing a 'cheating' throw (which is called bowling nowadays) from stalwarts like Muralidharan and 'full cover' Chanderpaul all made me only laugh at cricket nowadays and its spirit. Neverthless just enjoying the game as it comes, but that passion is already lost.

**plum** Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:24 pm

V_ - I am a rabid TN fanatic in Indian Cricket but dont have the time to explain - oNNu mattum I will tell- Dhoni oru Evil. Evil Evil Evil. nambAdhInga avanai

**V_S** Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:32 pm

Thanks plum for the note. Smile

As I said, I don't go much inside into the dressing room and other dirty politics behind the ground, but sure let me keep a watch.

Wizzy Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:50 am

Jadoo

guess he has any no freaking clue on which of his deliveries would turn, most of his dismissals were either bats unable to get to the pitch or trying to do so

Vijay is also with Rhiti...

all the major media houses are keeping mum on this , if Anil Kumble can be pulled up from NCA citing alleged conflict of interest(Tenvic)
what gives Mad

Wizzy Sun Mar 24, 2013 10:05 am

Ash displaying performance anxiety symptoms,land the ffing ball Mad

Wizzy Sun Mar 24, 2013 8:15 pm

whtya lousy side this OZ been turned into, vangaaladesam would have given India a better fight.
anything less than a 10-0 against this OZ side would be a one major Kohli on Cook/Andy's resume

Thank god for small mercies,Mijay will only be remembered for that phailed reverse sweep #thaenvinay

some 3 yrs ago Senile/Ravibot would have laid into Mijay for that shot #Bcciblazerdays #Seenugotallthebuttons

Nohit should have jizzed @ Ajinkya's brainfade, all hail #mumbaikhakhoosness

Twatto did a Dhoni by not giving Siddle a bowl #Twattothots

Dhoni hitting the winning runs yet again after Che doing all the donkey work Mad

with Dhonisheeps eulogizing his rise/fall
to a Rajinikanth movie at the sametime feigning ignorance of his side's home lose to Eng #greektragedy

Wizzy Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:10 pm

Wizzy wrote:V_S, with India not playing @ home for foreseeable future, we can exchange notes on Dhoni's legacy after he quits tests when the losses starts denting his commercial interest (only hope)

Ojha makes a smart move :cheers:ATG/Sehwag should bury the hatchet and join Rhiti sports

Another Indian cricket star, Pragyan Ojha has joined Rhiti Sports Management, the company that handles Mahendra Singh Dhoni amongst others.

Recently, Suresh Raina had also joined the talent management firm recently and this brings the total number of players/celebrities under the firm to six (Dhoni, Ravindra Jadeja, Suresh Raina, Pragyan Ojha, RP Singh and Saina Nehwal).

Pragyan Ojha has joined MS Dhoni and Suresh Raina on the Rhiti roster.

Founded in 2007 by Arun Pandey, who is Dhoni’s childhood friend, Rhiti Sports forayed into the world of sports marketing & celebrity management. And within a period of five years, they have made huge strides in the market.

Their philosophy, as proclaimed on their website, is simple: All management can be reduced to three words – people, product and profits. People come first.

Rhiti burst into the limelight in July 2010 when they announced that they have signed a Rs 200 crore three-year endorsement deal with Dhoni. It was the most expensive deal signed by a cricketer – beating Tendulkar’s three-year deal with sports management firm Iconix, signed in 2006, which was worth Rs 180 crore.

In September 2012, they also signed a 40-crore deal with Rhiti, making her the country’s highest paid sportsperson outside cricket.
http://www.firstpost.com/sports/ojha-joins-dhoni-raina-at-rhiti-sports-671365.html

now finds a place in 17 man squad for SA, this getting beyond ridiculous now, when was the last time India picked 3 spinners for a overseas tour.
grats to Dhoni for taking care of his 'assets' the clap

how I wish Windies scrap to a series win tomorrow

**plum** Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:20 am

Endha politiciankum kammi illa Dhoni. If he were a politician, Karunanidhi, Lalloo prasadiayellAm thooki sAptuduvAr corruption and nepotismla

**plum** Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:20 am

Endha politiciankum kammi illa Dhoni. If he were a politician, Karunanidhi, Lalloo prasadiayellAm thooki sAptuduvAr corruption and nepotismla

Wizzy Mon Dec 02, 2013 7:44 pm

plum wrote:Endha politiciankum kammi illa Dhoni. If he were a politician, Karunanidhi, Lalloo prasadiayellAm thooki sAptuduvAr corruption and nepotismla

sample this appavi Neil Manthorp who just doesn't get it.

http://www.supersport.com/cricket/blogs/neil-manthorp/Dear_Mr_Dhoni

Dear Mr Dhoni – or may I call you Mahendra? Perhaps even MS? We’ve never ‘properly’ met, not as ‘normal’ people anyway – there’s always been a table or a microphone between us. Anyway, I hope you don’t mind me writing. I haven’t got your email address so I’ll just have to hope someone passes this on.

I’ve always wondered why so few Indian cricketers have spoken out publicly in favour or support of issues which affect them, their colleagues or even the future and well-being of the game itself. I’m pretty good with the history of the game so I know there have been a few instances over the last five or six decades, but generally speaking, Indian players have done what they’re told to do.

It used to be that way on the field, too, didn’t it? Remember the way the national players before your generation used to meekly take the bullying and sledging from the Aussies, English and South Africans? Apparently they thought it was undignified to react, and Indians are rightly proud of their dignified heritage.

But you kept getting beaten. It was all very well having good manners, but it wasn’t much fun losing all the time. So things changed. Although there were players before him who refused to be bullied, Saurav was the first captain to encourage his players to stand up for themselves – even give a little back. Remember that time he kept Steve Waugh waiting in the middle for the toss? That was hilarious. Waugh was furious!

Anyway, I was just wondering whether you had considered taking the next natural step? You’ve been standing up for yourselves on the field for a decade or so now and look where it’s got you. A World Cup winner’s medal, A T20 World Championship, a Champions Trophy and, at various times, the No 1 ranking in all three formats of the game. You can’t argue with that! Congratulations! You and all your players have every reason to feel extremely proud.

The ‘next step’, as I see it, is to stand up for yourselves off the field. I know the BCCI won’t allow the players to form a Players Association – hell, maybe you don’t even want one? There is quite a bit of admin required, and I know you’re busy (although I’m sure there’d be a few office-type guys more than willing to do the paperwork).

Sachin never spoke out on anything, but that’s because he was even busier than you. Even when he was absurdly accused of ball tampering by the preposterous match referee, Mike Denness, here in SA 12 years ago, he refused to defend himself. The third test was cancelled. Many of us still think it’s odd that he never spoke out or tried to defuse the situation.

Anyway, this tour has got me thinking. Every single member of the Proteas test squad wants to play three tests. They are the champions, and you are the rightful challengers to their crown as the number-two ranked team. I assume you would like to play a proper series, too? I see your selectors have picked a squad of 17 players – including five fast bowlers – for two tests? Not leaving anything to chance, are they? That should be enough for five tests, never mind three.

Anyway, I was wondering what you felt about, maybe, suggesting that we do have the New Year’s test at Newlands, after all. My friends say there’s no way you would say anything which might upset your owner – I mean, the owner of your IPL franchise, N. Srinivasan – but I thought the opposite. Seeing as you know him so well, he might take it from you.

India would still have two weeks before the scheduled start of your tour of New Zealand so that wouldn’t be a problem. And don’t worry about the logistics, we’re pretty good at that stuff in SA. We hosted a whole IPL at 15 minutes' notice, remember? Newlands would love to have you. At the moment there’s a ‘Festival of Cricket’ being organised but, in all honesty MS – can I call you MS? – we’d much, much rather have you for a test match.

I reckon if you just said the word, it could happen. Just say: “We’d like to play three test matches” – and see how the ball will start rolling.

Unless you don’t want to play a proper series?

little does he know that MSD would gladly swap 2 tests for more odies/t-20s Laughing

**plum** Mon Dec 09, 2013 6:32 am

Few days back, we were debating how this YOUNG FEARLESS NEW INDIAN SIDE is unlike the one with old men Sachin, Dravid and co and can CHASE DOWN even 350.

Mentally strong
Determined
Winners

If only this side had been there in 2003, they said, we wouldnt have stumbled chasing 359. Even against Mcgrath Lee and co.

adhellAm summa Excuse they said, about the difference in quality of the 2003 opposition versus current opposition teams.

And what happened when they faced a half decent attack in a decent pitch?
Why, they couldnt chase 358, let alone 960.

Dhoni greatest captain, better than sachin as a winner. HA HA HA

Read it again HA HA HA

munnE oru kAlathula thandhiram migundha nari vAzhndhu vandhadhu

neela chAyam veLuthu pOchu dum dum dum
rAja vEsham kalanju pOchu dum dum dum

**plum** Mon Dec 09, 2013 6:33 am

Let me ask again:

neela chAyam enna Achu?

Thanks to diamandu kavignar for this situation song

Wizzy Mon Dec 09, 2013 7:57 am

with team sponsorship up for renewal after Dec, imagine if India were to play 7 odies+4 tests and were to loss by 150 runs each time,
Seenu maama knows his stock's true value the clap

the series again reiterated the fact Dhoni just doesn't know how to captain overseas.
on any given day regardless of pitch conditions, he defaults to 2 spinners/forever stuck in tactics of
stifling the opposition @ 5rpo in the middle overs and chase whatever they score. to make matters worse now he has
to raise some overs for 'Project Raina' so 25 overs of spin overseas is simply foolhardy. in the presser yesterday he praised the
bowlers for containing the opposition to 280 when successfully chased target is around 260 @ Durban . he ought to be the most defensive captain in cricket history.

neela chAyam veLuthu pOchu dum dum dum
rAja vEsham kalanju pOchu dum dum dum

just to think that only a week before a blue tattooed batter was touted to have surpassed Sach and been compared to King Viv laugh

al_gates Mon May 23, 2016 8:58 pm

V_S wrote:
Same way how much VVS has to prove to stay in the team, while the likes of Ravi Shastris, Manoj Prabhakars, Agarkars and innumerable others who doesn't even know how to play cricket were granted their undeserving places for a long time (some were even captaining India which was the biggest joke).

I am 3+ years late to read this thread but what can I say - time has given the answer already to V_S Saar's rant Smile

Wizzy Wed May 25, 2016 8:02 pm

^good times those doubt V_S watches much cricket these days Smile

**V_S** Wed May 25, 2016 9:55 pm

Yes I do very much Smile

Cricket is my religion too Wink

, but I opt to remain silent, haha!

Wizzy Fri Jun 10, 2016 10:00 am

V_S wrote:Yes I do very much Cricket is my religion too , but I opt to remain silent, haha!

come on, how do you rate Dhoni now? Smile

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