Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  fring151 on Sat May 31, 2014 9:47 am

By pro-ARR, do you mean TV again? I think radio is a much better barometer of popularity and tastes when it comes to music. When I was in college in Chennai and even now when I go for vacations, I like to take long walks in the night and it is amost always the oora therinjikittan and maanguyile poonguyile that I hear playing on the radio in biryani kadais, autorickshaws and potti kadais. The late evening, afternoon and early morning slots have always been dominated by IR (80s mostly). I don't think 80s IR has ever been out of vogue in Chennai.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  crimson king on Sat May 31, 2014 9:56 am

Not TV, but friends or friends of friends, friends of relatives, etc.  It was like, "yo machi, IR-galam la over, now it's Baba be to the ba and be to the ya" (or what have you). My cousin, as long as he was studying in Chetinad Vidyashram in Raja Annamalaipuram (and had friends from the Besant Nagar set, yes  Very Happy ), was also totally pro-ARR but after he shifted to PSBB in 11th, he ran into more IR fans and suddenly changed his views.  And the upper class always wants to mould public taste in a certain direction because they think they know better than the unwashed masses, blah blah.  In the 90s, radio was a pretty dull place to be.  Nobody could have foreseen the way private channels rejuvenated radio and made it lively all over again.  So they may have chosen TV as the medium to shape opinion.  Recall that I once mentioned a group of college girls coming on TV and saying IR was their 'piddikatha' music director.  These things may have been staged to an extent to promote a certain viewpoint of ARR vis a vis IR.  I am sure there are people who genuinely don't like IR's music and it is their choice and not for me to object.  But the way it was projected in that programme was as if IR was out of touch with the pulse of the youthu.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  fring151 on Sat May 31, 2014 10:39 am

CV is not exactly a plebeian institution, so I am not surprised. Also Besant nagar and all Ketkave vendaam. Waiting for Besant nagar vaasi Drunkenmunk to opine on this.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Drunkenmunk on Sat May 31, 2014 3:05 pm

fring151 wrote:CV is not exactly a plebeian institution, so I am not surprised. Also Besant nagar and all Ketkave vendaam. Waiting for Besant nagar vaasi Drunkenmunk to opine on this.
Ya. I studied in Sankara which is located in the border between Adyar and Besant Avenue. There was an ARR-elite clique that was considered coolest w.r.t music taste. Above that, you have Tamil Tambrahm (90% of kids who study there are tambrahms) girls who gyrate to Aikka Daajeebaa kind of Marathi hip hop stuff. IR ellAm 80s guy there. If you go below that, there are Vijay fans Razz Same for CV w.r.t elites. In fact, the CV guys who come into Sankara are "eliter" than Sankara folks. But like CK says, PSBB is more receptive to IR. Some of my best friends studied in NIT Trichy. I've been there with them during vacations and have met with folks from a wide range of schools in Chennai. And by the time, I was in UG and was into more of IR already (positively ARR fan till 12th std but more towards IR from college). Some of the most hardcore IR fans who scoff at ARR were from PSBB. Of course, the clique that went from Sankara (wonderful guys) were all ARR fans. There used to be all nighters where IR fans compare the effect of IR's music with 'theertham' and that is comparable to only Pink Floyd. And the wonder used to be IR was a teetotaler Very Happy There was one Varun H Sridhar who was H Sridhar's son and a big ARR buff (understandable) and the ring leader ARR fan from Sankara had their own group of ARR fans. No fights like what we see online but healthy discussions used to happen. And there were IR/ARR fans who liked both in equal terms. So IR vs ARR w.r.t Chennai is divided. North Central is IR's forte. South and South Central is ARR/Michael Jackson's fiefdom (and even in South Chennai, you have yours truly Wink). Out of Chennai, you have pockets of ARR influence like some uptown Coimbatore, Chengalpet and some parts of North TN. Anything south of Villupuram is positively IR.

In the bus journey to Trichy with friends, we would stop at a highway dhaaba after Villupuram at 2 AM. Positively only IR songs play all night. South TN kEkkavE vENdAm. Even in the mid-late 90s, that was pro-IR. Now, IR's current market rate has gone. But his 90s songs are positively popular South of TN. Madurai brought up P_R (@Dagalti) mentions how contemporary IR was still a force in Madurai in '94-96. And this is only w.r.t TN. Andhra except for some elite Himayatnagar types, the rest swear by IR (Plum's recent anecdotes and my dad's experiences with some executives in Hyderabad itself). Kerala and Andhra have more hardcore mafias than in TN tbh (Friend, mafia's, best friend and kooda piravAdha sister is Mallu and more hardcore mafia than all of us here. Many more examples abound in Kerala and IR's post 2000 has sizable respect there). And IR commands quite a sizable following in Karnataka too. No other composer imo has penetrated all the 4 southern states like IR has. Just, the elite Madras controlled media in TN doesn't reflect ground reality in TN (not the South Chennai clique who have no say other than parading their yuppieness online but the industry bigwigs who have axes to grind with IR).

Only Jaya TV is pro-IR while others are neutral to a fault. I think there are 2 factors at play here. The management in Jaya TV for these music-related programs is severely mafia based (led by Subhasree Thanikachalam who is a mafia herself). Secondly, I hear ARR is out of favor with Mummy. He was ignored for the 100 yr movie celebrations when IR was invited (which was attributed to him doing the Semmozhi theme for MK Razz ). If it is true, it is unfortunate. It will not affect him in anyway and in any case, she can't touch him openly because, to be honest, he is a darling of the elite masses (minimum oru 1 crore TN'laye irukkum). But then in this case, Jaya TV's mantle for music shows falls automatically on IR. Other than that, I don't think Mummy has any special love for IR's genius. Would be pleasantly surprised if she does exhibit genuine appreciation which we can discern from the platitudes.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  crimson king on Sat May 31, 2014 3:32 pm

LOL @ Aika Dajeeba.  Tell them that, far from being hip hop, it is considered positively plebeian stuff in Mumbai.  Not that anybody would look down on plebeian stuff there.  Maybe naive SoBo teens might open their big trap and then immediately get ridiculed for their accented Hindi (true story!  Razz ).  But that's it.  

All of what you said entices me to visit places in the heart of TN once.  Last was when I went to Kodaikkanal in 8th standard (this was '98).  I was obviously NOT looking at trends or such at that time though I do remember hearing Ennai Thaalatha Varuvaalo in a cab in Kodai.  On another note, I feel confused when I read that Kadhalukku Mariyathai was released in 1997.  Not that I doubt that info, but I distinctly remember watching it in the summer of 98, either Kaasi or Udhayam theater, don't remember which.  Maybe it was having a super extended run in that particular theater.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Drunkenmunk on Sat May 31, 2014 3:41 pm

crimson king wrote:LOL @ Aika Dajeeba.  Tell them that, far from being hip hop, it is considered positively plebeian stuff in Mumbai.  Not that anybody would look down on plebeian stuff there.  Maybe naive SoBo teens might open their big trap and then immediately get ridiculed for their accented Hindi (true story!  Razz ).  But that's it.
LOL fossible. There were a couple of half Marathi-half Tam gezhs in my class in +1 and +2. avunga Aramchu vechadhu dhAn idhu. apparam every year till today (if I'm not wrong) continues gyrating to this song in their +1 and +2 in the cultural events. I pity the school teachers who have to put up with the gezhs every year dancing to this. nAnga kEttadhu 2 yrs dhAn. Teachers kEkkaradhu every year laugh

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  crimson king on Sat May 31, 2014 3:46 pm

Yeah, Marathis do like that song down here too.  But it's not hip hop or any other kind of cooleth here.  They like their songs and rest of Mumbai largely goes along with Bollywood.  I remember watching some youthu group perform Bambai Rikshawala in a TV dance competition.  I mean, WTH.  If they genuinely like that song, it's ok but it doesn't fit into any kind of cultural contextualisation.  It's just some song that Maharashtrians like and you will hear it often if you travel in a vehicle driven by a Maharashtrian.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  crimson king on Sat May 31, 2014 3:51 pm

Possible that the TV channels' attitude has to do with the vayatherchal issue also.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Drunkenmunk on Sat May 31, 2014 4:27 pm

crimson king wrote:Possible that the TV channels' attitude has to do with the vayatherchal issue also.
For a good part, Sun network and Raj are decidedly neutral. Vijay alone has a pro-ARR bias which exhibited itself most awkwardly in the Super Singer Sugar Man series last yr. I don't know what happened during their Endrendrum Raaja series which they covered in Toronto and if Raaja gave them a snub there.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  fring151 on Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:58 am

Drunkenmunk wrote:
fring151 wrote:CV is not exactly a plebeian institution, so I am not surprised. Also Besant nagar and all Ketkave vendaam. Waiting for Besant nagar vaasi Drunkenmunk to opine on this.
Ya. I studied in Sankara which is located in the border between Adyar and Besant Avenue. There was an ARR-elite clique that was considered coolest w.r.t music taste. Above that, you have Tamil Tambrahm (90% of kids who study there are tambrahms) girls who gyrate to Aikka Daajeebaa kind of Marathi hip hop stuff. IR ellAm 80s guy there. If you go below that, there are Vijay fans Razz Same for CV w.r.t elites. In fact, the CV guys who come into Sankara are "eliter" than Sankara folks. But like CK says, PSBB is more receptive to IR. Some of my best friends studied in NIT Trichy. I've been there with them during vacations and have met with folks from a wide range of schools in Chennai. And by the time, I was in UG and was into more of IR already (positively ARR fan till 12th std but more towards IR from college). Some of the most hardcore IR fans who scoff at ARR were from PSBB. Of course, the clique that went from Sankara (wonderful guys) were all ARR fans. There used to be all nighters where IR fans compare the effect of IR's music with 'theertham' and that is comparable to only Pink Floyd. And the wonder used to be IR was a teetotaler Very Happy There was one Varun H Sridhar who was H Sridhar's son and a big ARR buff (understandable) and the ring leader ARR fan from Sankara had their own group of ARR fans. No fights like what we see online but healthy discussions used to happen. And there were IR/ARR fans who liked both in equal terms. So IR vs ARR w.r.t Chennai is divided. North Central is IR's forte. South and South Central is ARR/Michael Jackson's fiefdom (and even in South Chennai, you have yours truly Wink). Out of Chennai, you have pockets of ARR influence like some uptown Coimbatore, Chengalpet and some parts of North TN. Anything south of Villupuram is positively IR.

In the bus journey to Trichy with friends, we would stop at a highway dhaaba after Villupuram at 2 AM. Positively only IR songs play all night. South TN kEkkavE vENdAm. Even in the mid-late 90s, that was pro-IR. Now, IR's current market rate has gone. But his 90s songs are positively popular South of TN. Madurai brought up P_R (@Dagalti) mentions how contemporary IR was still a force in Madurai in '94-96. And this is only w.r.t TN. Andhra except for some elite Himayatnagar types, the rest swear by IR (Plum's recent anecdotes and my dad's experiences with some executives in Hyderabad itself). Kerala and Andhra have more hardcore mafias than in TN tbh (Friend, mafia's, best friend and kooda piravAdha sister is Mallu and more hardcore mafia than all of us here. Many more examples abound in Kerala and IR's post 2000 has sizable respect there). And IR commands quite a sizable following in Karnataka too. No other composer imo has penetrated all the 4 southern states like IR has. Just, the elite Madras controlled media in TN doesn't reflect ground reality in TN (not the South Chennai clique who have no say other than parading their yuppieness online but the industry bigwigs who have axes to grind with IR).

Only Jaya TV is pro-IR while others are neutral to a fault. I think there are 2 factors at play here. The management in Jaya TV for these music-related programs is severely mafia based (led by Subhasree Thanikachalam who is a mafia herself). Secondly, I hear ARR is out of favor with Mummy. He was ignored for the 100 yr movie celebrations when IR was invited (which was attributed to him doing the Semmozhi theme for MK Razz ). If it is true, it is unfortunate. It will not affect him in anyway and in any case, she can't touch him openly because, to be honest, he is a darling of the elite masses (minimum oru 1 crore TN'laye irukkum). But then in this case, Jaya TV's mantle for music shows falls automatically on IR. Other than that, I don't think Mummy has any special love for IR's genius. Would be pleasantly surprised if she does exhibit genuine appreciation which we can discern from the platitudes.

That was an entertaining read  thumbsup.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  fring151 on Sun Jun 01, 2014 6:13 am

DM has mostly nailed it, but me too being South Chennai based, I wanted to jot down a few additional notes on this. 


  • Re: Besant Nagar, Adyar, many of my mother's side relatives are from around there and I have cousins who are CV/Sankara products. It is safe to assume unless otherwise stated that a upper-middle class specimen from thereabouts in the age group 5-35 is an ARR fan.  In addition the 5-15 ones today are also likely to be into Ani and GVP. The most IR they know or listen to is probably Mouna raagam and Agni natchathiram - basically Mani movie based songs. That's the other thing, they are typically Mani fans - some of them even go on to write books about him. IR's folksy, earthy songs usually 'disgust them'. They'll probably look down upon you as declasse if you declared 'Aarum adhu aazham illai' is your favourite song.
  • Growing up in that elitest and poshest of south Chennai localities, it is a wonder Munk got where he is wrt his musical preferences today. IR, old TFM and non-Kishore Kumar based old HFM are literally the antithesis of what the archetypal Besant Nagar - Sankarite Englees speaking yuppie likes
  • That said, school kids everywhere listen to a lot of crap, so no point analysing or drawing any conclusions based on that. However among the non-Besant Nagar, Adyar clique (yes, that is a unique demographic ), the picture that emerges of South Chennai might be slightly different IMO.
  • The middle-lower middle class who don't speak English as their first language is decidedly more receptive to IR. Though they might not dig too deep and are content listening to "classic IR", they usually have high regards for his genius, even if they think it would be nice if he were a tad more humble. But they are usually not that vocal or hardcore and also tend to like MSV, ARR, Vidyasagar etc. These people don't care much for Michael Jackson and the like and are predominantly TFM listeners. I would say they are probably the most enlightened of the South Chennai gang. Recently I ran into a bunch of them in the age-range 27-35 here in U.S. and it turns out they are all decidedly mafia! All of them. That's like 10 of them, all non-Adyar/Bessie south Chennai. 
  • I think the south Chennai folks (non-Adyar/bessie, sorry I have to add that qualification everywhere) often develop better taste once they are out of school/college and are free from peer pressure. That's been my experience, at least. I know a few friends who used to be indifferent earlier but have slowly but surely turned to IR more and more over the years. Granted I might have played some part in this but still...
  • In summary, I think the south Chennai middle class 15-40 demographic is on an average probably more slanted towards ARR, aided by a massive clean sweep (minus one) in Bessie/Adyar. But it's not like IR has no presence here. His 70s-80s classics remain hugely popular and he is certainly not a persona-non-grata or anything...
  • Conclusion - Munk deivam.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Drunkenmunk on Sun Jun 01, 2014 11:54 am

fring151 wrote:
Growing up in that elitest and poshest of south Chennai localities, it is a wonder Munk got where he is wrt his musical preferences today. IR, old TFM and non-Kishore Kumar based old HFM are literally the antithesis of what the archetypal Besant Nagar - Sankarite Englees speaking yuppie likes.
Largely agree with the post as such. But some more personal rants if you are up for it.

My college was also Adyar, Gandhi Nagar based near the ladies club and Bala Vidhya Mandir bloc, that leads along the Adyar river on this side with the Boat Club on the other side of the river with the slums in between (that's another sharp demarcation even in Besant Nagar which houses 2-3 huge slums. IR enters the households there. You can gauge it by walking from Bessie beach along the sea to the estuary where Adyar meets Bay of Bengal (where portions of En Gaanam Indru Arangerum were shot and, erm, Aayidha Ezhuthu was also shot Razz). Slums on the sea side of the Theosophical society have fishermen communities and it's IR island of fiefdom there and Besant Avenue on the other side of the TS which is poshmax and you-know-what). That divergence converges in Sankara school. On the opposite side was my college (a branch of Chettinaad Vidyashram again). I should say it is kind destiny that has lead me to IR. I met with a couple of friends from North Chennai who were hardcore IR fans and we rolled with Madai Thirandhu for Nostalgia in the inter-departmental culturals Razz
 
More importantly, at the end of the first yr, mom had to undergo 2 major surgeries and at one stage, there was only a 50:50 chance of survival (she is fine now but will come to this later) and so I ended up with my chithappas and chithis in T Nagar, which is also South Chennai but not as yuppie as Besant Nagar/Adyar would be. Chithappas slant more towards IR (so does dad but it's a mystery how I ended up appreciating IR more in T Nagar than Adyar/Besant Nagar. Must check the area basically Razz. But I do think I was free of peer pressure in T Nagar for a few months) and the initial steps towards fandom were laid there. Dad's college friend is an MSV mafia who calls ARR thagara dappa musician and he came with a bunch of old-is-gold MSV songs around the same time. Also, around exactly the same time, dad's college friends (NIT Trichy) met for a 25th yr reunion and they gifted themselves an old-is-gold Hindi collection (SDB, RDB, Madan Mohan, Salilda, Shankar-Jaikishen (maximum) nu kalandhu katti and both Tam and Hindi numbering to a few hundred classics each and certainly lead to an ear appreciating true melody as I perceive them today). So I'd say external and elder influences played their part.
 
And by 2011, I was a pretty hardcore IR fan till I discovered Eera Vizhi Kaaviyangal and decided it was not worth it being a hardcore fan of IR and changed colors to Mafia. Maximum discovery of lesser/unheard gems started then. Around 2 yrs back, I saw Udhiri Pookkal. The mom in the film suffers an abusive husband and eventually dies due to illness leaving a son and a daughter with a sadistic father. Outside the sadist father/husband everything else nearly happened 6 yrs back (8 now) and by the time S Janaki re-sings Azhagiya Kanne with the mom in her deathbed, I was weeping, lykyechild. Truly, even if IR had done only Udhiri Pookkal, I'd write a lifetime bond for just Azhagiya Kanne. Beyond all yuppieness, peer pressure, true rasanai, discernment, there is something fundamental for every human being. And outside his musical wizardry, IR manages to squeeze that fundamental emotion true to every human being and that is the reason he rules over South India's popular rasanai even today. And that is where, I knew what it felt to relate emotionally to an IR song like the teacher in Tirunelveli did to Devanin Kovil Moodiya Neram (http://solvanam.com/?p=22579). ivvaLo sollittu, I've been hearing that song only. My manadhil oru pAttu quote in between the rant:



fring151 wrote: That said, school kids everywhere listen to a lot of crap, so no point analysing or drawing any conclusions based on that. However among the non-Besant Nagar, Adyar clique (yes, that is a unique demographic ), the picture that emerges of South Chennai might be slightly different IMO.

True. The other extreme holds true too My younger sister (slanting mildly towards IR with some careful grooming Razz) studies in SRM and there are ARR fan ring leaders from CV. With them are a couple of wannabes from outside Chennai. One such outside Chennai kid (sister told me) was raving over Anil's velai illaa pattadhAri's guitar work and was exclaiming only Anil and maybe ARR can touch the chords attempted here and it was beyond IR to even attempt such chords  laugh But my sister's best friend is an IR fan (because of her dad), more hardcore than my sister, and resides in Besant Nagar. Two down yo! Jokes apart, I see a case where grounded parents can direct their kids from yuppie wannabeness to appreciating truer stuff in life and the propensity for wannabeeness remains excruciatingly high in Besant Nagar/Adyar.

fring151 wrote: Though they might not dig too deep and are content listening to "classic IR", they usually have high regards for his genius, even if they think it would be nice if he were a tad more humble. But they are usually not that vocal or hardcore and also tend to like MSV, ARR, Vidyasagar etc. These people don't care much for Michael Jackson and the like and are predominantly TFM listeners.
Largely true again. I have a friend from NIT Trichy who started in CV (know a couple of non-yuppie folks there too) and ended up in PS and is now in IIM who digs IR for his "classical genius" and hardly knows rare IR songs or even attempts to dig them but has a healthy respect for the man's music. In fact, a friend from twitter is a 28 yr old who digs MSV and Kannadasan more than even IR cool4  Also, my family (but for 2 Mambalam based maniacs who have healthy respect for IR's 80s and early 90s stuff) is predominantly IR based in Madurai and Dindigul. They are in awe of his classical genius and his Ramana Maharishi albums have high appreciation among the elders Smile

fring151 wrote: I think the south Chennai folks (non-Adyar/bessie, sorry I have to add that qualification everywhere) often develop better taste once they are out of school/college and are free from peer pressure. That's been my experience, at least.
I agree. The remedy imo is travel. The more you travel inside TN and South India and the more you interact with people of all classes and strata, you get free from peer nonsense and develop a taste and opinion of your own and if you have the wherewithal to defend it, great. My fandom and belief in Raaja's music got even more rounded in the US and I must say that at a get together of friends in Vegas 1.5 yrs back (the ARR fan group of Sankara/NIT Trichy that remains slanted a little towards ARR except for me), we were dancing to IR's folk numbers in a star hotel room Razz

fring151 wrote: In summary, I think the south Chennai middle class 15-40 demographic is on an average probably more slanted towards ARR, aided by a massive clean sweep (minus one) in Bessie/Adyar.
I said 2 previously. I managed to convert a close friend from Sankara who is based in the Thiruvamiyur/Besant Nagar border (I am Adyar/Besant Nagar edge so you can generalize us as Besant Nagar vaasis) in college days by playing How To Name It and though he doesn't know a lot of music, he becomes an active mafia once he hears humility and manidha nEyam in music these days Razz Of course, he's a football fan and seeing geniuses like Maradonna having not an ounce of grace off the field having no impact on how they perceive his on-field genius. So coming from from such a peer group that hardly gets cracked up over arrogance and ego, he extends the logic to art.
 
idhanaal nAn solla varuvadhu enna vendrAl, IT'S 3 MAFIAS IN THE AGE GROUP OF 15-30 IN ADYAR/BESANT NAGAR.


Outside all of this, one more observation. Mumbai has a sizable bunch of expat Tambrahms from Palakkad and Chennai regions who are all invariably upper/upper middle class yuppies (evinced by one howlarious example here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=594THI436SQ nothing at all against this endeavor (a poor family gets something, so all for it) despite all the cynicism I have in the show that surrounds this endeavor but the translator is laugh laugh what I am taking about). anga 15-35 comblit clean sweep for ARR.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  crimson king on Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:16 pm

In Mumbai, not many Tambrams remain connected to Tamil music or Tamil films.  Those of us who have extended family in Chennai (my mom's side in my case) have a Tamil connection otherwise a lot of Mumbai Tambrams are not interested in Tamil culture.  Some of them only speak faltering Tamil at best.  Naturally Ilayaraja doesn't enter the frame.  Oder generation-la those who had such a Tamil connection kept up with 80s/early 90s Raja but thereafter lost touch.  When my mom posted an FB update about the songs of NEPV, the responses were only like IR is anytime awesome blah blah with no specific comments on the music.  In other words, they likely didn't know that such a soundtrack was out in the market. Even otherwise people in Mumbai are generally busy or like to keep busy even when they aren't because of a perennial late sitting culture so people who have time for conversations on  music are in a minority.  However, they tend to be more open minded and less opinionated than what I have encountered in Chennai.  My chittaps is a hardcore MSV fan so he will simply dismiss IR with one line, "avanuku guitar-mattum dhan theriyum" with no justification offered.  This kind of behaviour I have encountered often in Chennai on different topics, sorry to say.

Forgot to mention, majority of non brahmin Tamils in Mumbai get into business.  Usually the business of selling stuff that Tamils need like dosa maavu, kumudam, muruku, etc.  I have felt a strong 80s IR slant among them (of course never asked in detail about their tastes, only observed) but they definitely plump for IR much more than ARR.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Drunkenmunk on Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:23 pm

crimson king wrote:In Mumbai, not many Tambrams remain connected to Tamil music or Tamil films.  Those of us who have extended family in Chennai (my mom's side in my case) have a Tamil connection otherwise a lot of Mumbai Tambrams are not interested in Tamil culture.  Some of them only speak faltering Tamil at best.  Naturally Ilayaraja doesn't enter the frame.  Oder generation-la those who had such a Tamil connection kept up with 80s/early 90s Raja but thereafter lost touch.  When my mom posted an FB update about the songs of NEPV, the responses were only like IR is anytime awesome blah blah with no specific comments on the music.  In other words, they likely didn't know that such a soundtrack was out in the market. Even otherwise people in Mumbai are generally busy or like to keep busy even when they aren't because of a perennial late sitting culture so people who have time for conversations on  music are in a minority.  However, they tend to be more open minded and less opinionated than what I have encountered in Chennai.  My chittaps is a hardcore MSV fan so he will simply dismiss IR with one line, "avanuku guitar-mattum dhan theriyum" with no justification offered.  This kind of behaviour I have encountered often in Chennai on different topics, sorry to say.

Forgot to mention, majority of non brahmin Tamils in Mumbai get into business.  Usually the business of selling stuff that Tamils need like dosa maavu, kumudam, muruku, etc.  I have felt a strong 80s IR slant among them (of course never asked in detail about their tastes, only observed) but they definitely plump for IR much more than ARR.
Agree. My thAthA every time Kanne Kalai Maane plays, pokes by saying pichakkAran thALam pOdra mAri irukku without any further substantiation. Oh and btw, he is a Naushad fan and so scoffs at even MSV and Kannadasan and the likes. adhAvadhu, andha kAlathulayE oru Hindi wannabe. But w.r.t Mumbai's Palakkad and TN Tambrahm vAsIs in the 15-35 age group, definitely ARR of Hindi is a sure pull and thereby his Tamil works get enough curiosity and play time at homes?

And of course, dhArAvi pakkam ellAm Raaja domination not surprising.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  crimson king on Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:38 pm

Not really.  In fact, they don't all of them even go gaga over ARR, whatever he or his coterie want to project.  If you ask them, they might respond with all sorts of superlatives about him but they are just as happy to listen to the latest Sajid Wajid chartbuster.  Um, anything that works on the dance floor is ok so they pay no particular obeisance to ARR.  Getting curious about TFM BECAUSE of ARR is not something I have seen very often in Mumbai.  Mumbai culture is much more ephemeral what with it being a melting pot and generally more liberal so what music one likes or doesn't like is not considered a very emotive issue among peers.  Of course, at the same time, it is so huge in terms of population that even the minority that is passionate about music is a large number so as and when ARR organises a concert in Mumbai, he is bound to draw a big crowd for his HINDI work.  You can go to a Rahman concert or a, er, Rock On band concert (if you remember that film  Razz) or a  jazz concert in Mumbai all alone or with just one friend, find lots of people with that same interest as you have come for the show and then never meet them again on a day to day basis.  It has a very different rhythm which, errrm, I hope will survive the Modi sarkar onslaught.  Razz

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  fring151 on Mon Jun 02, 2014 11:13 am

Ya, parents and older siblings can definitely play a guiding role. Even if as teens, kids rebel and stray, as they get older, the chances of them going back to re-explore the music they shrugged off in their childhood is higher, especially if that music happens to be IR  Smile 

Drunkenmunk wrote:evinced by one howlarious example here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=594THI436SQ

 rotfl2

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  mythila on Mon Jun 02, 2014 2:31 pm

Very interesting insights about the demographic distribution of IR patronage, esp among the south chennai populace. Would like to know how it is distributed over the rest of Tamilnadu , say district wise.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  fring151 on Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:44 am

Last week, a friend in Chennai pinged me saying an IR song starting with the word 'pon' had played on radio and that he couldn't recollect much else about it except that it was sung by IR and he had never heard it before. Now this is not a Besant Nagar noob, but a propah veteran IR fan, born and brought up in Chennai with elder brothers who are HCIRFs and so it obviously couldn't be your 'Pon maalai' or 'Pon maane' - the famous ones that is. I hit upon the song on YT almost accidentally a few days back. And what a song it is - been stuck with it ever since. Chorus substitutes for violins and the guitar is in fact the only instrument used in the song!! Yet, the arrangement with its intricate vocal harmony and counterpoints employing only female chorus is so rich that it virtually sounds orchestral!!


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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Usha on Sat Jun 14, 2014 7:27 pm

Aathu mettulae - Audio is tooooooooooooooo Good......... Guitar sound is very nice......... Thanks to RajsMed.......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79E5G5dS1r0

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Usha on Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:30 pm

Raja gopuram kadannu

paatu .. starts with Classical...... upto 0.41.......

from.. 0.42. it changed into Western Beautifully. without gap.. . without Jerk........ anga irukar IR..............

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JolWYsTxnI

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  vaticanscientist on Wed Jun 18, 2014 1:18 am

There is this song in the telugu Movie - SITARA (1984) - Jilibi palikula
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPBwAk_ZhSU

This Song has the same tune as 'Oru Kili Urugudhu' from Anandha Kummi 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPRh8DYIi_4

Difference is in the Orchestra. Interludes sounded different to me.
Illayaraja gave the 'Jilibili' song an urban feel and the Oru Kili song a rural feel.

Somehow they kept 'O Maina O Maina' in both the songs.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  kiru on Thu Jun 19, 2014 4:58 am

fring151 wrote:Last week, a friend in Chennai pinged me saying an IR song starting with the word 'pon' had played on radio and that he couldn't recollect much else about it except that it was sung by IR and he had never heard it before. Now this is not a Besant Nagar noob, but a propah veteran IR fan, born and brought up in Chennai with elder brothers who are HCIRFs and so it obviously couldn't be your 'Pon maalai' or 'Pon maane' - the famous ones that is. I hit upon the song on YT almost accidentally a few days back. And what a song it is - been stuck with it ever since. Chorus substitutes for violins and the guitar is in fact the only instrument used in the song!! Yet, the arrangement with its intricate vocal harmony and counterpoints employing only female chorus is so rich that it virtually sounds orchestral!!

Isn't it strange that only after Rahman people start using the term 'harmony' ? (some of us ignoramuses used to call all these as chorus those days).Look at the layers here   Because of recording it is all way in the back.
And the drumming is cool, isn't it ? Raja .. bring on the drumkit.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  fring151 on Thu Jun 19, 2014 8:58 am

kiru wrote:Because of recording it is all way in the back.

Maybe that's why Brangan once wrote no one does (vocal?) harmony like ARR...

BRangan wrote:Adiye is a reminder that no one arranges harmonies better than this composer. Harmonies aren’t just about clean voices and coordination but also the recording, the spotlessness of which should blow away the murk around commingling pitches — the results are stunning.

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  Drunkenmunk on Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:46 am

fring151 wrote:
kiru wrote:Because of recording it is all way in the back.

Maybe that's why Brangan once wrote no one does (vocal?) harmony like ARR...

BRangan wrote:Adiye is a reminder that no one arranges harmonies better than this composer. Harmonies aren’t just about clean voices and coordination but also the recording, the spotlessness of which should blow away the murk around commingling pitches — the results are stunning.
Really want someone to remaster Pon Oviyam and upload online (I uploaded one on youtube but that's not remastered, I mean the background harmony with the chorus in the charanam is sex and to hear it amplified with a remastering would be worth paying for). Mastering sound and giving great sound to listen is really fine and appreciable but to confuse it with harmony is  laugh


Last edited by Drunkenmunk on Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:51 am; edited 2 times in total

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Re: Manadhil oru paattu - Song of the moment - Vol 1

Post  groucho070 on Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:47 am

I like ARR too...but that second quote is piffle, veering towards a trifle intent to lift one ball higher than the next. I have since learned not to take his writing seriously content-wise. Style is good, but content is questionable (like most of the shit I write myself, where I suck on both - and many have stopped taking my opinions seriously too...ithu eppadi irukku).

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