Taking next gen MD's into account...

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  Usha on Sun Oct 06, 2013 9:47 am

Vidhya sagar. Raaga usage.......... really Great............

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUc2X4x55CE


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7VYMlkTYOk

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:20 am

crimson king wrote:I don't hear any SIGNATURE as such of Vidyasagar either.  He is good at crafting memorable melodies (in itself a very difficult thing) but it's not like if I line up three or four of them, I could tell that they are all by the same composer.  I am interested to know fring's views, whether he has spotted any distinct trademarks of Vidyasagar.  He is a bit of a chameleon, like the yesteryear composer Ravi, but when he writes melodies, he does a tasteful job.
Nothing very concrete I can glean - he does usually go for simple and minimalistic arrangements. As he is primarily a Carnatic based composer and I don't know much about Raagas, it is hard for me to comment on that aspect, but let me try - this might seem vague, but if you take 'Un samayal arayil', 'Aasai aasai', 'Poovaasam', there's this precise logical way in which he carries the tune forward line-by-line, particularly in the charanams which I like very much and is reminiscent of some of IR's compositions along those lines like 'Kanmani nee vara kaathirunden'. 

As for the kuthu paatu genre and his forgettable songs, thankfully, either I have not heard many of them or have and (obviously) don't remember. Not my loss, I suppose Smile

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  crimson king on Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:40 am

Yes, I do agree that his tunes tend to show a logical progression.  It is rare that the charanam is resolved in an awkward manner.

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  Usha on Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:48 am

kuthu paatu.. VS.. nalla dhan irukum............

madhurai

http://starmusiq.com/tamil_movie_songs_free_download.asp?MovieId=700

bambara kannu  stanza.......end portion. really nice........


Ice katti ice katti......  sweet and soft kuthu...........

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  app_engine on Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:49 pm

crimson king wrote:
Either with Gemini or Dhool.  
That horror was by Baradwaj Embarassed

Vidyasakar sometimes cleverly copies old melodies.

Per vijayr, his famed 'malarE mounamA' is taken from the anupallavi of Shankar Ganesh song 'avaL oru pachchaikkuzhandhai...'. The portion that goes like 'kAdhal deivangaL...vAzhththudhE' is supposedly ditto with malarE mounamA pallavi.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdg78yqoaBA

However, I love his 'dhavam inRi kidaiththa varamE' (movie : anbu)! Awesome!

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  app_engine on Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:53 pm

WIth mild inspiration from 'chinna chinna Asai', Vidyasakar did an awesome 'veNNilA chandana kiNNam' in azhagiya rAvaNan (MFM - I believe Vidyasakar had better works in MFM)...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBSw0kVh-2E&feature=player_detailpage

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  app_engine on Sun Oct 06, 2013 1:13 pm

See this "WONDERFUL" score:

https://twitter.com/selvaraghavan/status/386487799110983680/photo/1

rotfl2

(For those challenged with notations, this is like the 1st page of "Easiest Piano Course for beginners" Laughing )

#MahlerOfMadras
#SymphonyScore

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  crimson king on Sun Oct 06, 2013 1:43 pm

app_engine wrote:
crimson king wrote:
Either with Gemini or Dhool.  
That horror was by Baradwaj Embarassed
Ah, I confused with Ghilli which has the 'uber' kutthu paatu of all time, Appidi Podu.  By the way, the original kutthu paatu was probably written by IR - "Sikaadha" from Sethu but both the beat and the vocals are much more restrained...just an extension of songs like Ae Atha/Annatha Aaduran.

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:04 pm

app_engine wrote:Per vijayr, his famed 'malarE mounamA' is taken from the anupallavi of Shankar Ganesh song 'avaL oru pachchaikkuzhandhai...'. The portion that goes like 'kAdhal deivangaL...vAzhththudhE' is supposedly ditto with malarE mounamA pallavi.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdg78yqoaBA
I heard the SG song and I think calling Malare mounama a copy is totally unfair. If anything, it is a great demonstration of inspiration Vs copy. It's also not like he composed the song by stitching together portions from various sources, there is a clear logical progression in the whole song. Besides SPB has sung both songs, so it is probably something that Vidyasagar composed with the consent/consultation of SPB.

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:14 pm

app_engine wrote:See this "WONDERFUL" score:

https://twitter.com/selvaraghavan/status/386487799110983680/photo/1

rotfl2

(For those challenged with notations, this is like the 1st page of "Easiest Piano Course for beginners" Laughing )

#MahlerOfMadras
#SymphonyScore
More like what a piano beginner is supposed to do before the instructor arrives - i.e nothing. Those small dashes below the second line are 'Rest' notes, so that's one whole page of 'nothing' that Ani and Selva are exhibiting to their 100,000+ followers and receiving hundreds of likes and retweets. Such all-round perception and enlightenment.

Btw who will be #ChopinofChennai? I nominate GVP.


Last edited by fring151 on Mon Oct 07, 2013 1:16 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Mon Oct 07, 2013 1:15 am

Another nice Vidyasagar song - pleasant Reethi Gowlai, reasonably original exploration of the Raagam, particularly in the charanam (from my noob perspective), though the female chorus is meh - sort of like filler material.


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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:26 am

Listened to this song just to 'explore' GVP. This just sums up the problem with these new age MDs. They use all these simpleton chord progressions and guitar riffs that simpleton country and pop bands have been doing in the west for ages and they get praised for sounding new and modern? Any person exposed to a little bit of western rock and pop can immediately see just how elementary this is. This is the type of song that has zero musical value in my book.


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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  Drunkenmunk on Mon Oct 07, 2013 5:25 am

fring151 wrote:Listened to this song just to 'explore' GVP. This just sums up the problem with these new age MDs. They use all these simpleton chord progressions and guitar riffs that simpleton country and pop bands have been doing in the west for ages and they get praised for sounding new and modern? Any person exposed to a little bit of western rock and pop can immediately see just how elementary this is. This is the type of song that has zero musical value in my book.
This was a song that got acclaimed by even fellow music directors like James Vasanthan. Like Vivek says in Lovely, "andha nelamaiyila irukku aaspathri ellaam."

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  crimson king on Mon Oct 07, 2013 5:43 pm

fring151 wrote:Listened to this song just to 'explore' GVP. This just sums up the problem with these new age MDs. They use all these simpleton chord progressions and guitar riffs that simpleton country and pop bands have been doing in the west for ages and they get praised for sounding new and modern? Any person exposed to a little bit of western rock and pop can immediately see just how elementary this is. This is the type of song that has zero musical value in my book.

Why you no like that song, the feel is so awesome...not!   I have similar feelings about Aaromale.   Maybe these folks think audience will not consider it 'international' unless they make it sound very obviously like western pop.   And when IR composes Kalvane, that millipede, oops milliblog dude, says the scale change is bizarre and writes it off.

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:54 am

crimson king wrote:Why you no like that song, the feel is so awesome...not!   I have similar feelings about Aaromale.   Maybe these folks think audience will not consider it 'international' unless they make it sound very obviously like western pop.
Yes. They also bank on the ignorance of their fans- a very bankable fact. See, there is nothing wrong or unpleasant sounding about these songs as such (which is why such chord progressions are part of beginner western music or guitar lessons) , and there are about a hundred pop and rock songs which use the same (or similar) chord progressions. But there is absolutely nothing new GVP brings to the table with this song. Who wants to hear recycled western pop tunes with retrofitted Tamil lyrics? (Er..that is a rhetorical question..I know there are probably millions who want to). Worse than Aaromale was 'Adiye' which was again a very standard Blues progression retrofitted with tamil lyrics - poorly sung, if I may add - besides desperately lacking in nativity.

But ultimately, I doubt if GVP or Anirudh or HJ are really interested (or even capable of) composing anything of lasting value. They are happy with their legions of fans eagerly lapping up 'MAlai neram' and 'Chennai gangsta', appearing in talk shows, acting all humble and simple, being featured on page 3, dating beautiful women (nothing wrong with that), not to mention charging crores of rupees per movie and laughing all the way to the bank!

And meanwhile, one man, at the age of 70 is still busy studying jazz, still refining his orchestration, experimenting with new instruments and meticulously writing songs and BGMs that fit the narrative and somehow still retain his signature and nativity...

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:47 am

Another GVP. The general formula is quite clear - get female to sing simpleton tune with wannabe, husky voice, use filler guitar licks and just somehow fill up the rest of the space. The 1st interlude amused me. He tries to start in almost a Raaja-esque way with heavy strings, but completely loses direction and it just ends up as another aimless interlude. It only goes further downhill from there. The charanam and 2nd interlude are total filler material.

Sorry for trolling GVP and apologies to any of his fans here, but this is just too funny Smile . Reading the comments on youtube is also quite amusing


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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  crimson king on Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:16 am

lol, in both interludes, he's trying to imitate IR interludes and it simply doesn't work.  If he is such a youth-u composer, why doesn't he try to do something else.  tongue 

Adiye chords sound a lot like Supertramp's Ain't Nobody But Home.  




And the melody has definite shades of Stevie Wonder's Maybe Your Baby.  



I am not saying he copied from them but it's ironic that the so called new gospel music that they would have  us believe Kadal is, is little more than a homage to two of the most popular 70s artists, and two of their most popular tunes too.

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  Drunkenmunk on Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:45 am

crimson king wrote:I am not saying he copied from them but it's ironic that the so called new gospel music that they would have  us believe Kadal is, is little more than a homage to two of the most popular 70s artists, and two of their most popular tunes too.
Quite agree. Again here, the guitar chords resemble Elay Keechan's guitars. Nothing wrong in taking a base. But these are sounds we get to hear from such bands https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-QG4tfJheo

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:36 am

crimson king wrote:Adiye chords sound a lot like Supertramp's Ain't Nobody But Home.  
And the melody has definite shades of Stevie Wonder's Maybe Your Baby. 
Indeed! As I said, that particular blues progression is very standard and you are likely to find some variation of it in hundreds of blues based songs. So I am not too surprised. It's not a copy, but well, he seems to have taken ideas from these songs, but not added anything remarkably new. They don't seem to have 'inspired' him is what I mean. Take 'Malare mounama' which we discussed here. I agree Vidyasagar probably took the cue for the pallavi from the SG song, but I love the way he has taken the melody forward adding his own touches and composing an entirely original and beautiful charanam. That's inspiration in my book.

drunkenmunk wrote:Quite agree. Again here, the guitar chords resemble Elay Keechan's guitars. Nothing wrong in taking a base. But these are sounds we get to hear from such bands https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-QG4tfJheo
Indeed!! again!! The guitar riff/bassline is almost entirely the same throughout the song. Read what I just wrote above. Same applies here. Is ARR jaded? Not motivated any more to give us another Bombay or Alaipayuthey, or even a Minsaara kanavu or Iruvar? These songs seem to me to be utterly uninspired, almost as if they were hurriedly put together to meet a deadline or something. I heard the Kochaiadiyan song, btw - 'Nenje ezhu 2'. I have posted the song in the ARR thread. We can discuss it there.

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  crimson king on Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:18 pm

Drunkenmunk wrote:
crimson king wrote:I am not saying he copied from them but it's ironic that the so called new gospel music that they would have  us believe Kadal is, is little more than a homage to two of the most popular 70s artists, and two of their most popular tunes too.
Quite agree. Again here, the guitar chords resemble Elay Keechan's guitars. Nothing wrong in taking a base. But these are sounds we get to hear from such bands https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-QG4tfJheo
That is the identical riff except that the tempo is faster in Elay Keechan!!  Even the tone is near identical (if not 'it') so I wonder if he just downloaded it to his computer and used garageband or some such software to speed it up!  

fring:  Exactly, the feel of Adiye was the same as those songs, no Rahmanization of the ideas happening there at all.  Kadal was one of his most uncharacteristic soundtracks and people called it a return to form after JTJH!  At least Jiya Re had some cool chords in the antara (though I now wonder about their 'source' too).  At any rate, it was unmistakably ARR which I never felt with Kadal tracks.

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  jaiganesh on Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:17 pm

indha threadum thevayaa?

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:34 am

jaiganesh wrote:indha threadum thevayaa?
Don't we need to keep abreast of what the GenY MDs are dishing out? Smile Plus it's good fun Laughing

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  jaiganesh on Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:11 am

fring151 wrote:
jaiganesh wrote:indha threadum thevayaa?
Don't we need to keep abreast of what the GenY MDs are dishing out? Smile Plus it's good fun Laughing
I think this forum is for people who are sick and tired of all that trite being dished out in promotional programs in 
TVs and FMs. So bringing their junk in here again kinda diverts the focus - dont you think?

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  fring151 on Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:03 am

jaiganesh wrote:
fring151 wrote:
jaiganesh wrote:indha threadum thevayaa?
Don't we need to keep abreast of what the GenY MDs are dishing out? Smile Plus it's good fun Laughing
I think this forum is for people who are sick and tired of all that trite being dished out in promotional programs in 
TVs and FMs. So bringing their junk in here again kinda diverts the focus - dont you think?
Personally, I don't think so. Maybe that's also because I currently have zero exposure to recent Tamil Movies and songs. Even Maalai neram was new to me. Listening to this stuff also gives me a perspective on what the current MDs are up to, and where youth tastes lie. Evidently they all seem to be busy borrowing standard tried and tested templates from American pop and getting acclaimed as hip and trendy. I am, however open to appreciating anything interesting these guys come up with. Anyway, I'd like to hear what others have to say about this...

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Re: Taking next gen MD's into account...

Post  Nerd on Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:15 am

What's forum without a little fun? So I vote 'for'.

Have you guys listened to this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjqF-K-uBN0

Thambi, when squeezed by good directors can really bring out some super stuff, I am confident Very Happy

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