Megha / மேகா

irir123 wrote:yenga poi muttikkaradhunney therla - Yuvan thaan paadanumnu GM azhudhu kettaaraa ?

YES!

Actually, the sad state of affairs in TFM today is this : IR NEEDS OTHERS (Yuvan one among them) to promote / reach his works to Thamizh makkaL!

I told this in twitter and got some thittu from our friend SKV (because I mentioned Kamal there, in the London concert context and SKV is very sensitive to anything Kamal)

dig
If one has twitter account that connects with SKV, it's possible to view the whole discussion, which I would call "storm in twitter cup":

https://twitter.com/tekvijay/status/372394763859030016

end-dig

Namma TN makkal yenna Yuvanai oru periyya thillalangadi singeraa aakkittaangalaa ??

yenbaa, avaru yenna daily 6 hrs saadhagam panraaraa enna ? 

I hope IR does not use him for a 'sangeetha jaathi mullai' kind of song only for it to reach the bubblic !

andha alavukkaa namma makkals rasanai matrum soranai izhandhu nikkiraangalaa yenna ? 

yov, IR potta nalla paattaiyey nangellam manikkanakka alasi aaraainju pirichu urichu menjirukkom - Yuvan as a singer would have been trashed ad nauseum in the 80s

EKSI

dig

irir123 wrote:Namma TN makkal yenna Yuvanai oru periyya thillalangadi singeraa aakkittaangalaa ??

ada neenga vERa, even the Oscar MD wants his voice! (mariyAn)

end-dig

BTW, despite all such reservations w.r.t. Yuvan, I love 'sAindhu sAindhu'

"Saindhu" is a masterpiece no doubt about that!

but would have been better if a SPB had done it - am not even a big fan of Karthik (singer) btw!

irir123 wrote:Namma TN makkal yenna Yuvanai oru periyya thillalangadi singeraa aakkittaangalaa ??

yenbaa, avaru yenna daily 6 hrs saadhagam panraaraa enna ? 

I hope IR does not use him for a 'sangeetha jaathi mullai' kind of song only for it to reach the bubblic !

andha alavukkaa namma makkals rasanai matrum soranai izhandhu nikkiraangalaa yenna ? 

yov, IR potta nalla paattaiyey nangellam manikkanakka alasi aaraainju pirichu urichu menjirukkom - Yuvan as a singer would have been trashed ad nauseum in the 80s

EKSI

when u1 sings his own songs - he is wise enough to autotune most parts - when ARR used u1 the whole damn song was autotuned - When raaja does a song he is adamant from 'engineering' the voice output - if it had been done, ppl like you or app might have ended up liking it. Having said that - this is fate - we have no control over it.

jaiganesh wrote: if it had been done, ppl like you or app might have ended up liking it

illeeng sir, my problem is not sruthi and such stuff

So, auto tune won't help
(BTW, did I ever say I liked Yuvan's Yuvan song or ARR's Yuvan song? appadi idhu varai illai )

In any case, I'm not the right person to certify male singer voices

I have a bad history of disliking many

dig

BTW, there's this Sharath in current SS4!


If properly brought up and if he continues to have good career attitude, discipline etc, he can be the next SPB!

And I mean it! (My recent gu(i)lty pleasure was his 'appadippOdu pOdu' this week. One should watch how he effortlessly did 'kAttukkuyilu manasukkuLLa', both SPB & KJY portions on this TV show in one of earlier rounds )

end-dig

he is one of the few chamathus in that gang.

irir123 wrote:MEGHA is great - but what would have been a complete masterpiece is ruined by the choice of singers - Yuvan is terrible, to say the least - why is IR insisting on Yuvan as a singer I cannot fathom ?

here is a heartfelt opinion of a renowned Jazz critic after listening to IR's recent works :

"i regret just beginning to explore The Maestro's music at this point in his career, and wish i had heard some of his earlier music.
i really wish i could have heard this soundtrack as purely instrumental music. 

His gift for arrangements and dynamics within songs is exquisite. and it IS very cool to hear his voice on this soundtrack, too.
 
With that said, some of these vocals add nothing of value to this music. i understand that these vocals are important from a thematic perspective (to help advance or comment upon the action in the film). but i'd have loved to have heard some of these tracks in their purest form, before the vocals were put on top.
 
that first piece (he is referring to Saindhu saindhu from NEPV) would have been a beautiful Pat Metheny tune, for example, without the vocals on it.
 
this has been a genuinely wonderful experience for me, and i'm grateful you've taken the time and trouble to expose me to his work, and you've been so patient with my commentary upon it."

yenga poi muttikkaradhunney therla - Yuvan thaan paadanumnu GM azhudhu kettaaraa ?

in Megha, Yuvan (and also Priyadharshini) spoil all the fantastic work done by everyone else - nalla vela Londonla recording/mastering - illaatti andha luxury kooda illaama, ivanga kurala kekkara piravi payan namakellaam

Yes.. I agree with you. Wish there was a separate CD with just the background score with a lead instrument replacing the vocals. Over the time, I have adapted to ignore the lyrics and just listen to the score.

jaiganesh wrote:
when u1 sings his own songs - he is wise enough to autotune most parts - when ARR used u1 the whole damn song was autotuned - When raaja does a song he is adamant from 'engineering' the voice output - if it had been done, ppl like you or app might have ended up liking it. Having said that - this is fate - we have no control over it.

I really .. I should go listen to that mariyaan song. I skip the yuvan/ramya version. One should see IR conduct himself while singing mugilO in the teaser.
Re: lyrics - We are in a different socio-economic part of the world. We need movies to fund the production of music. Lyrics are an inevitability. To me it is fine. We are a much more literature/poetry driven people. Our standards might be going down, but it is still an art form that I continue to enjoy.
General music awareness/standards in the US might be high, but the population in general may not be listening to much higher quality music than the film music listeners of India.
Re: irir123 and the jazz critic - I guess white people tend to focus on things in isolation. Film music in india is a genre that borrows from different genres to present a particular mood/raagam/tune in a light classical manner (atleast as applied to IR's music). It is a popular music format but not necessarily focussed on exploring the rhythm, harmony or melody aspect of it in in-depth. But people like IR can go in-depth if opportunity presents. Also, white people tend to underestimate the harmony/chord expertise of musicians from other cultures (see what Peter Gabriel's studio does to other musicians - they force a white guy to collaborate with them, whether it is NFAK or Ali Farka Toure). Even Rahman is appreciated for the melody and as an astute person, he proactively employs other musicians on the rhythm/harmony aspects of things. I am sure there are lots of american/english musicians involved with him now.
Of course, this is a more subjective opinion. I do appreciate music from different parts of the world, but everybody has their own pre-conceived ideas and biases.

jaiganesh wrote:finished listening to mugilo meghamo 4 times and kalvane 2 times - problem with this album is so obvious - idhai thaandi aduththadhukku poradhukku oru janmam aagum pola. 
yuvan and nsk nallaa thaan paadi keeraango. raasa in his version takes it to the level of vaanam mella + edhaya baagilu - muzhusa kaettu mudippanaannu doubt irukku.. paappam.

Yes, kalvanE starting sounds like that and the other similarity is the niram pirithu parthEn as appropriately mentioned here already.

kiru wrote:

jaiganesh wrote:
when u1 sings his own songs - he is wise enough to autotune most parts - when ARR used u1 the whole damn song was autotuned - When raaja does a song he is adamant from 'engineering' the voice output - if it had been done, ppl like you or app might have ended up liking it. Having said that - this is fate - we have no control over it.

I really .. I should go listen to that mariyaan song. I skip the yuvan/ramya version. One should see IR conduct himself while singing mugilO in the teaser.
Re: lyrics - We are in a different socio-economic part of the world. We need movies to fund the production of music. Lyrics are an inevitability. To me it is fine. We are a much more literature/poetry driven people. Our standards might be going down, but it is still an art form that I continue to enjoy.
General music awareness/standards in the US might be high, but the population in general may not be listening to much higher quality music than the film music listeners of India.
Re: irir123 and the jazz critic - I guess white people tend to focus on things in isolation. Film music in india is a genre that borrows from different genres to present a particular mood/raagam/tune in a light classical manner (atleast as applied to IR's music). It is a popular music format but not necessarily focussed on exploring the rhythm, harmony or melody aspect of it in in-depth. But people like IR can go in-depth if opportunity presents. Also, white people tend to underestimate the harmony/chord expertise of musicians from other cultures (see what Peter Gabriel's studio does to other musicians - they force a white guy to collaborate with them, whether it is NFAK or Ali Farka Toure). Even Rahman is appreciated for the melody and as an astute person, he proactively employs other musicians on the rhythm/harmony aspects of things. I am sure there are lots of american/english musicians involved with him now.
Of course, this is a more subjective opinion. I do appreciate music from different parts of the world, but everybody has their own pre-conceived ideas and biases.

I agree. It is quite sad that, in our country, music (apart from classical music) cannot exist as an art form independent of movies. Similarly, I find it quite puzzling when certain people castigate Ilayaraja for putting music ahead of lyrics, as though it is the sacred duty of a composer to uphold the glory of the tamil language.

That said, even with these constraints and handicaps imposed by our retarded society, the best of Indian film music as an art form is as good as any other art form in the east or west, particularly in subtle emotional expression and the spectrum of influences, and I personally think there is not much to be gained in asking western critics to review Raja's work.

kiru wrote:

jaiganesh wrote:finished listening to mugilo meghamo 4 times and kalvane 2 times - problem with this album is so obvious - idhai thaandi aduththadhukku poradhukku oru janmam aagum pola. 
yuvan and nsk nallaa thaan paadi keeraango. raasa in his version takes it to the level of vaanam mella + edhaya baagilu - muzhusa kaettu mudippanaannu doubt irukku.. paappam.

Yes, kalvanE starting sounds like that and the other similarity is the niram pirithu parthEn as appropriately mentioned here already.

Oh yes.. the difference is with "NiramPirithu", the string sections are longer. A while ago when I played that song to one of my Indian friend who is an avid Jazz fan was like "who is the MD?"
Megha songs are so good that I have started spending time listening to it during the weekdays now. Have been listening it for couple of hours every day since I got hold of the CD. At one point, the software player started playing other songs and man... the quality of older songs forced me to go back to Megha  ). The difference in resolution in not even comparable. The usage of bass guitar in "EnnaVaendum" is simply superb.

I am in absolute love with this latest gift box - Megha - from the Maestro.
 Mugilo, Jeevane, Kalvane, Chellam konjam - all are great in their own ways but I would like to comment specifically on Jeevane.
I have never heard this deep a cry of desperate loss, loneliness and helpless misery in a song before.
'Vaanam thottu pona' from Devar Magan comes to mind but that was a collective expressing their deep respect for a bereaved soul.
'Vaarthai thavari vittai' from Sethu deals with similar emotions but that song is also marked by a sense of resignation.
'Jeevane' on the other hand just expresses the unsharable cry of personal desperation and loneliness like no other. And to do that in a rock format (beginning with an operatic chorus ala 'Vaanam thottu pona') is just beyond imagination. Thankfully the Maestro doesn't 'think' in genres. He simply uses his entire toolkit, be it western classical, jazz, folk, carnatic, blues so seamlessly to bring out the exact emotion he is intending to express. I am just plain lucky to be showered by his gifts.
 I was just overcome by emotions listening to Jeevane the third time. Unbelievable!

lyrics of jeevane - there is union - but pain in tune - wonder why?

முகிலோ மேகமோ சொல் வேறு வேறு
இரண்டும் இரண்டோ பொருள் ஒன்றுதானே
உடலால் தேகத்தால் இரண்டான போதிலும்
உயிரால் உணர்வினால் அது ஒன்றுதானே
நீயோ நானோ இரு ஜீவன் ஒன்றே

முகிலோ மேகமோ சொல் வேறு வேறு
இரண்டும் இரண்டோ…

இதயத்தின் அறைகளில் புதிய வாசம்
மனமெனும் வனங்களில் மலர்ந்த பூவின் நேசம்
நினைவெனும் அலைகளில் வலையை வீசும்
விரல்களை இதயமே விரும்பியே சேரும்
காதலின் சேட்டைகள் காரணம் நீயடி
பார்வையின் வேட்டைகள் தைத்தே வில்லடி
இனிமைகள் எது எது அது நமக்கு நடுவிலே

முகிலோ மேகமோ சொல் வேறு வேறு
இரண்டும் இரண்டோ பொருள் ஒன்றுதானே

நா.. நா.. நா.. நா ந நா நா.. நா.. நா..

கடற்கரை மணலிலே நடந்து போனேன்
சுவடுகள் அனைத்திலும் உன்னை நான் பார்த்தேன்
கலங்கரை விளக்கமும் விழியில் பார்த்தேன்
அலை எது கரை எது குழம்பியே போனேன்
சிறகுகள் விரிக்கிறேன் பறவையே பறவையே
தவழ்கிறேன் குதிக்கிறேன் மழலையே மழலையே
அருகிலும் தொலைவிலும் நெருக்கம் நீயேதான்

முகிலோ மேகமோ சொல் வேறு வேறு
இரண்டும் இரண்டோ பொருள் ஒன்றுதானே
உடலால் தேகத்தால் இரண்டான போதிலும்
உயிரால் உணர்வினால் அது ஒன்றுதானே
நீயோ நானோ இரு ஜீவன் ஒன்றே

முகிலோ மேகமோ சொல் வேறு வேறு
இரண்டும் இரண்டோ…

Please correct me if there are any mistakes I just love the lyrics, not outstanding, but not average too, quite good and sits well on the tune without sticking out.

Few lines are just beautiful; The anu-pallavi lines; உடலால் தேகத்தால் இரண்டான போதிலும், உயிரால் உணர்வினால் அது ஒன்றுதானே, நீயோ நானோ இரு ஜீவன் ஒன்றே AhA ithavida vEra enna vEnum. I melt hearing these lines.
First line of 1st charanam. I never heard such thought before; இதயத்தின் அறைகளில் புதிய வாசம், while other lines in 1st charanam are just ordinary.
In 2nd charanam these lines; கடற்கரை மணலிலே நடந்து போனேன், சுவடுகள் அனைத்திலும் உன்னை நான் பார்த்தேன். Just out of the world and we can certainly feel the heart of lovers in this line. So moving! Then the stunning finish to charanam with அருகிலும் தொலைவிலும் நெருக்கம் நீயேதான்

One other line which I thought was just ordinary, but the way Yuvan sings it and gave life to it, it became extra-ordinary all of a sudden --> அலை எது கரை எது குழம்பியே போனேன். Especially hear how Yuvan sings 'குழம்பியே போனேன்' even better than his father. I rewind this word again and again. This song was so nicely done by Yuvan (even bearing his limitations) and Ramya NSK, that I don't have any major complaints. This song is tooooooooooooooooooooooo good!

RajaDivine,
Welcome to the forum and thanks for the special first post. You have touched the chord on the amazing JeevanE JeevanE song. So true, it has everything in it as you described. Please write your thoughts on other songs as well.

Since I posted link to that R D Burman-compare-blog, I must also post this link for twitlonger of Sridhar sir here:

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1rm6l18

ராஜா என்ற ஆர்.டி.பர்மன் என்று இல்லாத ஒன்றை திறமையான எழுத்தின் மூலம் நீங்கள் கண்டடைய முயல்கிறீர்கள். ராஜா என்ற ராஜா மட்டுமே என்பது தான் என்னுடைய விவாத உள்ளடக்கம்.

kiru wrote:

balachidambaram wrote: ...
One thing is clear. Raaja is in no mood to relax and has shifted a gear or two
in recent times. This is playtime.

About 40 years of learning and practising the art straight up from the fundamentals , taking no short cuts. Every song, every album has been a progress, but for us, it is difficult to see the difference unless it stares at our face .. Interesting thing is, he stayed the course, whether it is the onslaught of young MDs like Rahman or technology or the commericial value/awards going in whatever direction. He believed in himself, he believed in making music from first principles. What a fighter !! What a career lesson.

This is so true! His belief in his own abilities and approach (first principles that you rightly mention) never waned but what was probably missing is a feeling of being wanted. The feeling of being wanted is as powerful to a creator as his self-belief. This has been strengthening over the last few years starting from the critical appreciation of Thiruvasagam, Balki's endorsement and more recently Gautam Menon's efforts to sort of provide an additional boost.
 Also, we must not forget the Hungarian orchestra for Raaja's artistic inspiration. He finally found some peers that speak his language at that rarefied level. Raaja has again gone a little out of his comfort zone to re-invent himself and the 'new' sound/genre that he initially experimented with in Cheeni Kum (and may be as early as Mumbai Express as someone pointed out) is now reaching a level of maturity that can only mean great things ahead for us Raaja fans. Now that he is comfortable in his 'new' vocabulary, I expect many more gems like NEPV and Megha in the near future. I can't wait!!

Some wanted to know "who's this Anitha" (voice of putham puthukkAlai new version)...

Just to put a face with the voice - previous association for a rAsA event (watch at the 34th second, the time flag doesn't work when embedded in our forum post):

V_S wrote:RajaDivine,
Welcome to the forum and thanks for the special first post. :DYou have touched the chord on the amazing JeevanE JeevanE song. So true, it has everything in it as you described. Please write your thoughts on other songs as well.

 Thanks for the warm welcome V_S! I loved reading your posts as well! And yes, I shall definitely share my impressions about the other gems in the album as well. Oooh, I am loving it! I was happy enough listening to his older songs but now THIS?!

Maybe it is blasphemy .. even sacrilegious . like saying murugan is more beautiful than kannan.. but after listening to NEPV after a long hiatus Megha seems like a qualitative improvement over even NEPV and sounds way more smooth and natural .. the orchestra plays seemlessly along with the vocals in Megha.. actually it picks up when the vocals start.. He handles the orchestra like how a star rock musician would use his lead guitar ..IR also uses some of his older techniques/phrases with more confidence ..which were consciously avoided in NEPV.. the drummer has more interesting/varying things to play in Megha.. It sounds as though, IR did not want the rhythm to distract him while writing the parts for the orchestra in NEPV. In Megha, it is flowing smoothly .. we do miss a gelato melody like in vaanam mella .. but overall Megha is an achievement .. As RaajaDivine opines .. NEPV paved the way for this and IR came out of his comfort zone to write NEPV and Megha and he is getting comfortable in this ... Just like how he came out of his comfort zone to give some carnatic classics long ago. I am very positive he will write many more albums like this. May the almighty bless him with good health and long life.
(BTW, whether other MDs feel commercially threatened or not, this is sure to give them a complex :-) )

Again there are guitar flourishes here and there in Megha (with outstanding bass guitar in enna vEndum), but there were full songs carried mainly with guitar alone especially in pudikkala maamu, pengaL yendraal, mudhal murai (with some on high horns) relevant to the story and the mood. Sounds in Megha are rather smooth with smooth flowing sounds, rather than the hard-core, theatrical and dramatic NEPV which also tells the kind of lovers and their intensity. I am already excited. For me it's 8/8 vs 5/7. Nevertheless Megha is in the realm of sophistication, style, grandeur and SUBSTANCE and on its way to be regarded as one of the greatest soundtrack in IFM, but just behind NEPV.